BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 17:32

Username Protected wrote:

Turbine aircraft are required to have the instrument approach dialed in.

I was not aware of this rule.

May I inquire as to where it is written?

Mike C.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:04

Cite has been posted many times: I don't have it handy. Good policy for anyone on instruments; I did it in the P-Baron. As I said, on a visual, if you don't call runway in sight at some point, you'll be given the instrument approach and possibly missed.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:05

Username Protected wrote:

Turbine aircraft are required to have the instrument approach dialed in. On a visual, if one doesn't call the runway in sight by some point, they will be given the instrument approach. On the Garman, I dial in the approach from an IAF for situational awareness, and highlight the segment to the FAF so it doesn't go into suspend if I pass a way point.

Hmmm. Never heard that. What is the FAR? You say "the instrument approach". Which one or does it matter? Both DAL and MCO have parallel runways. Didn't know which runway we would get until last minute.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:14

Username Protected wrote:

Cite has been posted many times: I don't have it handy.

When you find it again, let us know.

Mike C.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:25

You've gotta be kidding me. I'm outta here.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:37

Username Protected wrote:

(2) Each pilot operating a large or turbine-powered airplane approaching to land on a runway served by an instrument approach procedure with vertical guidance, if the airplane is so equipped, must:

(i) Operate that airplane at an altitude at or above the glide path between the published final approach fix and the decision altitude (DA), or decision height (DH), as applicable; or

(ii) If compliance with the applicable distance-from-cloud criteria requires glide path interception closer in, operate that airplane at or above the glide path, between the point of interception of glide path and the DA or the DH.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:53

I'll be damned

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:56

Thanks Allen. I didn't word that as well as I could have. Of course, a visual doesn't have a missed. What I've found if controllers were busy and I didn't call airport in insight when they wanted, they immediately put me on the instrument approach. I assume so they knew where I'd be going and have a published missed. If the approach isn't dialed in, one can get behind things right away.
I'm trying to be helpful. If it's not fun anymore, I'll move along.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 19:00

Username Protected wrote:

Thanks Allen. I didn't word that as well as I could have. Of course, a visual doesn't have a missed. What I've found if controllers were busy and I didn't call airport in insight when they wanted, they immediately put me on the instrument approach. I assume so they knew where I'd be going and have a published missed. If the approach isn't dialed in, one can get behind things right away.
I'm trying to be helpful. If it's not fun anymore, I'll move along.

Always fun when I learn something.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 19:06

I'm learning new stuff every day, and you've been a big help. I guess I get grumpy when folks demand cites. I'm not their CFI and don't work for them. That said, communications on here is a bit spotty. Someone wasn't employing Dale Carnegie principles. Ask nice and I'll help all I can

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 19:07

Username Protected wrote:

I'm trying to be helpful.

You were helpful. Thanks!

What the rules says is if the runway has vertical guidance, and you are equipped, you should have it dialed in for large/turbine airplanes.

What this means is that anyone with LPV capability needs to have that dialed up even if the runway is not ILS served!

I wonder how this rule came to be and why it is applicable only to turbine/large.

Mike C.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 19:11

Sorry if I got grumpy. It was big stuff on my ATP. Actually, they strongly recommend having the instrument approach dialed in each time, but the reg does say where there's vertical guidance. I'll think you'll find many companies have it in op specs.
Uhhh might have prevented some folks from landing at the wrong airport.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 19:38

Username Protected wrote:

I wonder how this rule came to be and why it is applicable only to turbine/large.

Noise abatement from the days of noisy early turbine aircraft. Trying to keep them as high as practical around the airport.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 19:42

Username Protected wrote:

Thanks Allen. I didn't word that as well as I could have. Of course, a visual doesn't have a missed. What I've found if controllers were busy and I didn't call airport in insight when they wanted, they immediately put me on the instrument approach. I assume so they knew where I'd be going and have a published missed. If the approach isn't dialed in, one can get behind things right away.
I'm trying to be helpful. If it's not fun anymore, I'll move along.

I will call airport in sight but I will not call traffic in sight that they will then tell me to follow when cleared for the visual. Too hard to keep visual with a plane ahead while doing everything else needed for a safe landing SP. I take the approach and let the controller handle separation.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 19:44

Username Protected wrote:

I'll be damned

As the rookie turbojet pilot here we delegate to you to answer this question in the future when it comes up.

Flying the Citation II