04 Nov 2025, 04:22 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig.  Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:10 |
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Joined: 07/21/08
Posts: 5831
Post Likes: +7283
Location: Decatur, TX (XA99)
Aircraft: 1979 Bonanza A36
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Username Protected wrote: He's rude, antagonistic, arrogant, combative, and altogether unpleasant.
You can argue with manners. You can be right without condescension. but how do you really feel Nate? 
_________________
I'm just here for the free snacks
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:11 |
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Joined: 08/25/13
Posts: 615
Post Likes: +128
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Username Protected wrote:
Don't have any real time in a Cirrus other than a few demo flights. But 80 over the numbers in any piston single seems excessive in a slick airplane. I'm always aiming for 1.2 stall speed which in a cirrus should be right around 70knots over the numbers at 50 feet. Anything special about Cirrus where that sounds like way too slow of a speed?
80knots over the numbers in an Acclaim will add 1500 feet to your landing.
I'm sure you have a lot more experience than I do. I have experimented with landing slower than 80 but my normal practice is to follow a stabilized approach and to fly the airplane the way I was trained to. I've got less than 200 landings in a Cirrus so not a lot of experience in this airframe. Of course I have a lot more in Bonanzas and tail wheel planes. But I find that over the numbers at 80, as recommended by the manufacturer of the airplane, works quite well. Your point about a "slick airplane" is worth commenting on. I think anyone who has experience flying a Cirrus and a Bonanza will tell you that making a good landing in the Cirrus is more difficult. That wing on the Cirrus is a big part of the reason. It is more speed critical, in my experience, than the Bonanza's.
That's 197 more landings in a Cirrus than what I have  I remember the demo pilot being pretty clear about not getting slower than 80 too, so if it works, why mess with the good thing. Acclaim manual calls for 70knots to 75knots, depending on weight, so that's what I use. I find the airframe just does not want to shed speed in ground effect, like CBP brands tend to do, so I tend to fly it much slower. Need to fly a Cirrus some more. If the company didn't have a KA350, I'd get rid of the Acclaim and buy a G5 Cirrus. My useful load is 829lb But then it's only me and the wife in that airplane and 215knots in mid teens is hard to beat.
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:15 |
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Joined: 11/06/10
Posts: 12184
Post Likes: +3069
Company: Looking
Location: Outside Boston, or some hotel somewhere
Aircraft: None
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Username Protected wrote: I'm sure you have a lot more experience than I do. I have experimented with landing slower than 80 but my normal practice is to follow a stabilized approach and to fly the airplane the way I was trained to. I've got less than 200 landings in a Cirrus so not a lot of experience in this airframe. Of course I have a lot more in Bonanzas and tail wheel planes. But I find that over the numbers at 80, as recommended by the manufacturer of the airplane, works quite well.
Your point about a "slick airplane" is worth commenting on. I think anyone who has experience flying a Cirrus and a Bonanza will tell you that making a good landing in the Cirrus is more difficult. That wing on the Cirrus is a big part of the reason. It is more speed critical, in my experience, than the Bonanza's. Tony, I will help. Answer the following questions, and you will be able to give William the answer why 80 over the numbers works. - What is the stall speed clean and full flaps?
- What is the power required to maintain level flight at 80 clean and full flaps?
- What is the power required to maintain level flight with the stall horn beeping clean and full flaps?
- For short fields, what is the Cirrus technique for flaps?
-
Tim
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:39 |
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Joined: 01/16/11
Posts: 11068
Post Likes: +7097
Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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This is Beechtalk hazing and I will have no part of it.....  Geez, where's Marcus when you need him?
_________________
---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:52 |
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Joined: 01/14/09
Posts: 825
Post Likes: +313
Location: Boise, ID
Aircraft: 06 Meridian, C180
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Username Protected wrote: :popcorn: Mike C taking the Beechtalk creep factor to a whole new level! Seems like more and more of these trolls are popping up.....While temporarily amusing, I agree with JC that they are detrimental to the site. +1
Disagree Dino. Time, reputation, or # of posts on site does not give one more credibility than another. I have read the whole thread and JC clearly implies that PC-12 could get in when jets could not. To use real data to refute another's point is far better than opinion and hearsay. We all use Flightaware to track flights. Why is this creepy or stalking in this case? I appreciate that someone does some research before they post. We should respect that even if it means calling into question somebody else's claim, IMHO.
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:52 |
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Joined: 11/21/09
Posts: 12458
Post Likes: +17078
Location: Albany, TX
Aircraft: Prior SR22T,V35B,182
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Username Protected wrote: but how do you really feel Nate? Sorry, Doug. My normally very pleasant wife was being rude, antagonistic, arrogant, combative, and altogether unpleasant. Normally, she doesn't mind me hovering over BeechTalk while we play Scrabble.  It affected my normal gentlemanliness.
Last edited on 06 Jan 2015, 23:57, edited 2 times in total.
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:53 |
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Joined: 10/26/08
Posts: 4627
Post Likes: +1031
Location: Pinehurst, NC (KSOP)
Aircraft: 1965 Bonanza S35
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Username Protected wrote: This is Beechtalk hazing and I will have no part of it..... Geez, where's Marcus when you need him? He's out flyin for one of the "Majors", ain't got time for us lowly "private" pilots! 
_________________
dino
"TRUTH is AUTHORITY..... Authority is not Truth"
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:53 |
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Joined: 01/29/08
Posts: 26338
Post Likes: +13085
Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
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Username Protected wrote: JC clearly implies that PC-12 could get in when jets could not. And where was I proven wrong? PC12 get's in and out where many other planes cannot.
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 06 Jan 2015, 23:56 |
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Joined: 01/14/09
Posts: 825
Post Likes: +313
Location: Boise, ID
Aircraft: 06 Meridian, C180
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Username Protected wrote: He's rude, antagonistic, arrogant, combative, and altogether unpleasant.
You can argue with manners. You can be right without condescension. Sheesh. I am not sure if you are talking about Mike or Jason here. Or me? 
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 07 Jan 2015, 00:00 |
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Joined: 01/14/09
Posts: 825
Post Likes: +313
Location: Boise, ID
Aircraft: 06 Meridian, C180
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Username Protected wrote: JC clearly implies that PC-12 could get in when jets could not. And where was I proven wrong? PC12 get's in and out where many other planes cannot.
And some other planes COULD get in when PC12's could not. I think that was Mike's point. The plane is not the deciding factor. I think Flightaware proved that. Agree?
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Post subject: Re: That PC12 is biiiiiiiig. Posted: 07 Jan 2015, 00:01 |
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Joined: 01/14/09
Posts: 825
Post Likes: +313
Location: Boise, ID
Aircraft: 06 Meridian, C180
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Username Protected wrote: Wellllllll, if the shoe fits.........  OK. I'll be Cinderella and put on the glass slipper Deano.
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