They may be talking about SB 11-4 which converts a 500 to a 501SP. This allows single pilot operations. I've attached a copy of it to this post.

The SB from Cessna, however, states it can only be accomplished at a company owned service center. Maybe Sierra got an STC to do the same conversion?

In any case, there are a lot of weird things in the early days of the 500 and 501 and how things relate to each other.

Another example of this is the "long wing" mod. This extends the wing span of earlier Citations.

It can get very confusing what early Citations can and cannot do, SP or not, ceiling variations, gross weight variations, etc.

Mike C.

[
Thanks, I got ya Mark. I really don't have much emotion invested in this debate. I've seen where a two-man or three-man crew airplane can eat your lunch if combined efforts of the crew didn't put out a max level performance based on their experience, supplementing the captain. I have no doubt that an SP jet can eat somebody's lunch with a lot more ease than a jet with a crew.[/quote]

Paul:

There are two sides of this equation to consider risk and reward. We are in violent agreement that a crew is generally safer ( although Erwin is correct about quality of the SIC). What there won’t be (nor should there be) general agreement on the reward or cost side of things. That’s the unsolvable part of the equation. My reward/cost is different than yours. Can’t really solve for that.[/quote]

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Yes, we agree on risk tolerance varying with the individual, and we agree on the relative safety SP vs two-man crew.

So, now what can we argue about ?

Well how about the ease of flying the 737-800/BBJ single pilot. Just one big video game. Auto brake, auto throttle. VNAV. Shhhhhiiiitt You 121 guys with your two man crews...please. I’d fly that beast SP in a nano second. So simple once you understand buttonology and the way the systems interact. I have 12 hours in the sim. Another 12-15 hours it’s on. I might actually complete the ratings. My biggest issue is that twoof the most criminally toxic BTers did that and got their ratings. Some what a large deterent actually. Probably delay. CJ2 may7-17; plus atp then off to Lear school. I have a connection to a couple BBJ's. Who knows? Your thoughts are valued paul.

Let em reiterate.

1)Jessie few on a part 91:trip
2)all told, he flew enough hours to,meet the 142:spec. Signed him off As an sic. He made money.

3)he walked into SIMCOM and drops 12k gets a sim based type but rather than 26 days. 5 days.

1)Do this. Take your commercial written test. Then take your practical commercial test.
2) fly with me for 10,days. You make 5k.
3)you walk out with 20 hours of jet time with a SIC endorement
4)hand the endorsement to,SIMCOM.
5)SIMCOM will cut the type class in half becuase you earned it as an sic

I don't follow.

This doesn't get me to having a type rating, which I will need. The type rating course is $12K, they charge $9K for the SIC course, so I'm not seeing the savings.


I've met pilots who did the full type course, single pilot, in about a week. Simcom says 14 days, but they always overestimate. I expect to be on the shorter end of the time needed.


Yup, will start working on that, too. Got the test book, have someone lined up to train/test me in the MU2.




I got 10 years and 1400 hours in an MU2 flying on business everywhere, vast majority of it SP, often into busy metro areas. I'm an SP turbine veteran.

Compared to going from a 210 to the MU2, MU2 to Citation should be a lot less challenging.

Mike C.

Why do you need an SIC to log those things?

Mike C.

That is false. It's a grey area some abuse but you must have the waiver to fly any 500 single pilot. Single PIlot eligible is different than being certified single pilot.

I have not looked for any stats but my intuition is that the BBJ is on a higher plain than Citations when it comes to safety. The great automated systems are there (along with two Captains most often) to ensure there is never a mishap like the Citation partial panel mishap in Utah, the Citation working panel mishap at Burke or the Citation scud running mishap a few weeks ago. My guess is the thought of flying SP is about as foriegn an idea to the people paying for the BBJ as would be painting their own fence to save a few bucks.

<looking for my paint brush so I can save some bucks so’s I can buy a jet with outdated barely supported avionics that 5 owners back was a Fortune 500 owned jet>

I have not looked for any stats but my intuition is that the BBJ is on a higher plain than Citations when it comes to safety. The great automated systems are there (along with two Captains most often) to ensure there is never a mishap like the Citation partial panel mishap in Utah, the Citation working panel mishap at Burke or the Citation scud running mishap a few weeks ago. My guess is the thought of flying SP is about as foriegn an idea to the people paying for the BBJ as would be painting their own fence to save a few bucks.

What are BBJ contractors (if there are any) charging per day?

There are. Don’t know. 550-650 is $3k. So at least that. Problem is supply and demand. Lots of high time 737 retired guys. Comparatively few gigs

Which would you rather fly? I'm thinking BBJ would be better work.

More comfortable office.

That and I'm thinking less likely to be needing to lift bags.

Mark - notwithstanding your approach yields better preparation and experience, the Simcom simulator based type rating is 14 days, not 26.