BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 07 Nov 2018, 21:31

Let's talk about 3 point versus wheel landings. I'm not doing 3 points anymore in high performance or heavy taildraggers because I see an unlimited downside with no upside. The Widgeon is scary in 3 points as the elevator runs out. The Bucker had terrible visibility in this attitude. With a Searey, it's pretty rough on the fragile tailwheel. Wheel landings give one some speed to provide control authority along with superior visibility.

Thoughts on the upside to 3 pointers? What are people doing with P-51s, etc? I never see people three point landing the warbirds.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 07 Nov 2018, 21:52

Username Protected wrote:

if you're keeping track, he flew two airplanes a year, averaging 8hours a week at 325kts average speed, (52weeks/year), recreationally

but now says a harmon rocket will work

sounds like the mission has changed, though i've never seen one stated on the prior airframes, looks like occasional travel and visiting family, still don't understand where all the time comes from

I fly my airplane regularly, like people use their car, I commute between three cities, and I work full time, I'm seeing half the hours he does and I'm going slower apparently, so there's lots of head scratching here

why not buy a L39? you have 1500 hours in jets now- right? you don't need the four seats anymore, you like to burn jet-a

For the record, Brian runs a creepy airplane stalking website that tracks ADSB and assumes you are always transmitting ADSB and aren't on anonymous or off. Creepy stuff Brian, you are logging my time in IV-P for me. Why on earth would you do this or care?

Here are a few creepy stalking tracks off his stalker website:

https://flight-data.adsbexchange.com/ac ... cao=A7C3D2

Brian, stop assuming you are my digital hobbs meter and logbook. Most people don't want to be tracked and your interest in N6P is impressively creepy. More importantly; it doesn't matter. As your own record shows, I fly my Lancair often as a "car" as you say and it has served me well. Please stop tracking me and calling my experience a lie; it's not.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 07 Nov 2018, 23:24

There are airplanes that can't, or shouldn't be 3 pointed, and there are airplanes that can't or shouldn't be wheel landed.

The P-51, DC-3 and Twin-Beech are in the former category.

The Wildcat is in the later category. I can't think of any thing else in that category right now.

As for the rest, a proficient pilot should be equally adept at both 3 pt and wheel landings.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 00:27

Doug: Don't forget the Pitts Special. The real hot dogs can do wheel landings after a beautiful airshow routine, but us "reglar" folk prefer the three point, as I can keep more control, and reduce the chance of getting into a pilot-induced porpoising show. There is great satisfaction in pulling an artful three-pointer in that wonderful little airplane.
As to the 180, I was taught wheel landings by the folks at Mission Aviation Fellowship. It is a lot kinder on the tail stinger, and one can exert good control on difficult airstrips.
YMMV,

Tom

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 05:36

Username Protected wrote:

There are airplanes that can't, or shouldn't be 3 pointed, and there are airplanes that can't or shouldn't be wheel landed.
The P-51, DC-3 and Twin-Beech are in the former category.
The Wildcat is in the later category. I can't think of any thing else in that category right now.
As for the rest, a proficient pilot should be equally adept at both 3 pt and wheel landings.

In my experience, the Auster is difficult, if not impossible, to “wheel” on.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 05:50

Sure enjoy this discussion of Rockets...

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 11:03

Username Protected wrote:

In my experience, the Auster is difficult, if not impossible, to “wheel” on.

I have a Taylorcraft L-2 and have flown numerous BC-12s (US version of an Auster for the Colonist) and I have land all of them 2 pt and 3 pt regularly.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 12:56

I was surprised watching an old movie, that P-47s were 3 pointed. In this training film it was taught that way. (plus a little cheesecake)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y3v1-WMJS8

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 16:28

Sorry to sidetrack a bit:

I'm actually interested in Rockets and am going to look at one next Monday, but I recently learned that my current insurance provider couldn't find anyone to insure me in a Rocket. I currently have 0 hours of tailwheel time. I would plan on getting proper instruction, but I'm not sure how many hours it would take to get insured (even liability only, they acted like 50 might not do it).

Any thoughts on the best path to getting tailwheel time. I'm not sure how serious I am about getting one and have also thought about going to the opposite end of the GA spectrum and getting a Kitfox or similar for some fun slow flying. If I did that to build tailwheel time, would that translate over to the Rocket - and would insurance be good with those hours?

Thanks,
Rich

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 16:38

Username Protected wrote:

Sorry to sidetrack a bit:

I'm actually interested in Rockets and am going to look at one next Monday, but I recently learned that my current insurance provider couldn't find anyone to insure me in a Rocket. I currently have 0 hours of tailwheel time. I would plan on getting proper instruction, but I'm not sure how many hours it would take to get insured (even liability only, they acted like 50 might not do it).

Any thoughts on the best path to getting tailwheel time. I'm not sure how serious I am about getting one and have also thought about going to the opposite end of the GA spectrum and getting a Kitfox or similar for some fun slow flying. If I did that to build tailwheel time, would that translate over to the Rocket - and would insurance be good with those hours?

Thanks,
Rich

Buy an RV and fly it for a year or two, then move to the Rocket, but you may find you are happy with the RV. If it weren't for all the X/C I do, I would be perfectly happy with a RV. But that extra 25 kts is really nice, especially when pushing a 25 kt headwind.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 08 Nov 2018, 20:05

I flew my buddy's RV-7 quite a bit and have found the Rocket to be easier to land than the RV. Neither is particularly hard to land but the Rocket is extremely easy. Rocket insurance is expensive. The irony is Rocket insurance costs close to what IV-P insurance costs with less than half the hull value. The IV-P requires annual recurrent training like a jet though.

With regards to three point landings, I guess I'll re-evaluate them in the Rocket this weekend. Doug, if I was going to own a warbird, it will be a Wildcat. I think that's why I love Widgeons so much as the wing, tail and gear are Wildcatish (possible identical) and that's exactly how it flies; like a fighter.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 09 Nov 2018, 00:15

Username Protected wrote:

Sorry to sidetrack a bit:
Any thoughts on the best path to getting tailwheel time. I'm not sure how serious I am about getting one and have also thought about going to the opposite end of the GA spectrum and getting a Kitfox or similar for some fun slow flying. If I did that to build tailwheel time, would that translate over to the Rocket - and would insurance be good with those hours?

Thanks,
Rich

The gentleman below is highly regarded by the RV folks on the VAF forum for tailwheel training. He uses an RV-8 and believe he is located in southern TX.

Bruce Bohannon - Contact Info

Email: flyalegend@gmail.com

Cell: 281-889-8078

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2018, 20:34

Username Protected wrote:

I was surprised watching an old movie, that P-47s were 3 pointed. In this training film it was taught that way. (plus a little cheesecake)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y3v1-WMJS8

That was a Great Video Jeff :clap:

I really Enjoyed it!
Thank You for Posting! :cheers:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2018, 08:44

How not to 3 point: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLC4QsgGjek

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2018, 09:58

I’m with Doug on being proficient on both wheel landings and 3 pointers. Again, I’ll say the best training I’ve ever gotten has been playing CFI in the back of my Champ. You never know what predicament your students will put you in but you will instinctively take over. I’ve had the opportunity to fly with Mark Fredrick early on and really considered building an F1. (I probably should have) There is a great article in this month’s Sport Av on the Rocket that Doug might want to comment on.