02 Feb 2026, 20:40 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50  Posted: 07 May 2016, 12:35 |
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Joined: 12/03/14
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Username Protected wrote: Not the autopilots fault, right? Correct. It is the pilot's fault for relying on the autopilot. The reliance can be short term, that particular flight when the pilot was not monitoring it or ready to hand fly in the instant of need. The surprise factor can be a huge problem, like AF447. The reliance can be long term, the pilot becomes autopilot dependent from lack of hand flying regularly enough and then can't handle the airplane manually when needed. Advocating a pilot never perform a hand flown approach in IMC is bad advice which contributes to lack of hand flying skills. You need to be capable, current, and confident in your ability to that, and the only way to do that is to practice it for real regularly. Mike C.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 12:42 |
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Joined: 11/09/13
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Quote: .Advocating a pilot never perform a hand flown approach in IMC is bad advice which contributes to lack of hand flying skills. You need to be capable, current, and confident in your ability to that, and the only way to do that is to practice it for real regularly.
Mike C. Completely agree hand flying skills matter. Don't leave home without them! Just don't take passengers on your training flights!
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 13:00 |
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Username Protected wrote: Just don't take passengers on your training flights! Agreed. Hand flying an approach is not training, it is proficiency. If you disagree, then you are taking passengers on a "training" flight when you hand fly a takeoff. Mike C.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 13:16 |
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Username Protected wrote: Pascals MU2 had a failure that required hand flying. It did? How do you know that? Mike C.
Just going by your posts in his Crash Thread. What is the latest consensus?
My point is..... just because someone crashes while hand flying doesn't mean "automation" was the cause.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 13:22 |
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It's practice to maintain proficiency.
Be sure to tell your passengers you will be practicing on their flight.
I am sure they won't mind!!!!
Or maybe they would prefer you practice some other time.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 13:46 |
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Username Protected wrote:
Advocating a pilot never perform a hand flown approach in IMC is bad advice which contributes to lack of hand flying skills. You need to be capable, current, and confident in your ability to that, and the only way to do that is to practice it for real regularly.
Keep beating that straw man. Nobody is advocating this.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 13:51 |
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Username Protected wrote:
Advocating a pilot never perform a hand flown approach in IMC is bad advice which contributes to lack of hand flying skills. You need to be capable, current, and confident in your ability to that, and the only way to do that is to practice it for real regularly.
Keep beating that straw man. Nobody is advocating this.
Down my way we call it "pounding sand".
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 14:39 |
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Username Protected wrote: Nobody is advocating this. Steve on April 3rd: The time to practice is when the weather is good not when it's bad!
When it's bad, it's game on and all tools should be used.Yes, somebody is advocating you not hand fly in IMC. Mike C.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 14:43 |
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Username Protected wrote: Nobody is advocating this. Steve on April 3rd: The time to practice is when the weather is good not when it's bad!
When it's bad, it's game on and all tools should be used.Yes, somebody is advocating you not hand fly in IMC. Mike C.
So Steve either changed his mind or he has a different opinion?
Damn I hate it when somebody is wrong on this damned Internet!
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 15:19 |
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Username Protected wrote: Just going by your posts in his Crash Thread. I never said Pascal had a failure. It is a possibility, but there's no evidence given for one yet. Mike C.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 15:42 |
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Username Protected wrote: Just going by your posts in his Crash Thread. I never said Pascal had a failure. It is a possibility, but there's no evidence given for one yet. Mike C.
I agree. I re-read that post you made. I think I misunderstood.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 18:12 |
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Quote: Steve on April 3rd:
The time to practice is when the weather is good not when it's bad!
When it's bad, it's game on and all tools should be used.
Yes, somebody is advocating you not hand fly in IMC.
Mike C. Quote: So Steve either changed his mind or he has a different opinion?
Damn I hate it when somebody is wrong on this damned Internet! My opinion is unchanged. Using automation when the weather is bad is safer than hand flying. If I need to practice/train or whatever you want to call it, I try to do it in good weather and either by myself or with a safety pilot. I can't imagine using a "revenue"'trip for practice/training. If you are not proficient in both the use of your automation and hand flying then get proficient before you load innocent passengers. If you want to practice/train to it on a empty leg.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 19:06 |
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"I can't imagine using a "revenue"'trip for practice/training."
Kinda sorta sounds like IOE/TOE to me.
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 19:36 |
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Only if the check airmen restricted the new guy from using any automation.
Or even better let the new guy go without a check airmen and do not allow him to use any automation.
It could also go,something like this.
,"Welcome aboard lady's and gentlemen the weather at our destination is bad and I am feeling rusty so I am going to use this leg as practice. I will not use any of the automation available to me. This will allow me to keep up my proficiency at hand flying."!
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Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50 Posted: 07 May 2016, 20:00 |
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So IOE/TOE isn't training in revenue service and the LCA's only interest is in automation?
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