Not at all, Jason. It’s a matter of economics. There is a lot more value to a new plane than a 50-60 year old plane with a warranty and the latest gizmos, it’s just that most people can’t write the check. Those that can write the check sometimes do buy new. There just aren’t a lot of people that can. Change the economics of new planes and more would be sold.

But the economics of a new plane is also an issue of the capability of a new plane vs used. Even a new G58 has little more capability than a used one, mostly in the area of avionics and some in the area of crashworthiness, but when it comes to carrying a load sometimes less. Often the competition for a manufacturer is not another manufacturer but their own airframes from years past. For the most part the new Beechcrafts and Cessnas are still the same airframe and motor from many years ago. Cirrus seems to be the only innovator in this market and they are doing relatively well. Look at the current thread regarding the experimental market. I think there would be a substantial market for these planes new were they manufactured with a legacy name at the price point they are at.

Kudos to Diamond for trying to innovate, I wish others would follow.

But had a comparable and/or equal new plane been available for even twice what I paid for mine I would have purchased new. Unfortunately the cost differential is on the order of 8x.

Mike

Mike you make some valid points.
All things wear out, but new takes a hit, just like in the car game. Depreciation is heaviest in the beginning.
Many people buying new get the advantage of depreciation through their business, especially if it's a business aircraft.

Ditto

Anyone have data on the relative dispatch reliability of old vs new planes? I like my '66 baron, but lots of stuff breaks. We fix it when it does, but there are just a huge number of 50 year old things to fail. I would guess (but don't know) that after you get out of the infant mortality problems, a new plane would be a lot more reliable.

Its not a huge deal for my operation, but it could be for some people. I also simply can't afford new.

I disagree. Have you used a GFC700 autopilot?

No, I have not. But my S-Tec 30 with GPSS does everything I need it to do except fly the glideslope, and I can manage that pretty well as can most. If I wanted that I could upgrade to a 55x. I may not know what I am missing, but an autopilot alone does not have me coveting a new plane any more at the cost delta. Now if I could install the set up Arlen has......

As mentioned earlier dispatch reliability and all new components are the most attractive attributes of a new plane. Most of the other stuff can be retrofitted. But an AMU here and there still leaves a lot left over for gas when opposed to the cost of new.

Mike

I think we all agree that new/newer is obviously better but the price delta is very steep which limits our desire to purchase new.

I would agree with Jason that the newer avionics and autopilots are simply outstanding.

And I agree with that 100%

Mike

From and older thread:



Some people just want new. People pay a huge premium for new cars all the time. They pay an even bigger premium for new airplanes, sometimes. That's just the way it goes. Just because you are willing to buy old airplanes (as I am) doesn't mean it's valid to compare the price of a new airplane with the price of an old airplane. The market for new airplanes consists of people who want to buy new airplanes.

You're not everyone

I never said I was. I speak from my own perspective, not anyone else's. If I had 700k to shell out on a new plane I would love to fly one. But as it is I am grateful I have the witherall to be among those that can fly my own plane. If the only choice was to buy new or go without I would not be flying.

In the car business it is said there is a bucket for every seat, my bucket fits a used Corvette but not a new Ferrari. But would love to have a ride in yours!

Mike

I’ve never had the opportunity to sit in a brand new GA plane but I imagine it can’t be any different than sitting in a brand new car. I usually always buy a few years used, but there is just something about buying a brand new car that can’t be replicated. The smell, cleanliness, brand new upgraded everything and being able to pick every color and style to make it your own is worth the couple extra thousand in my book. I imagine buying a brand new plane is the same experience except it’s only a few 100k more.
The thought of leaving the factory with a big smile on my face, getting everything the way you wanted it is priceless.

I considered a new DA40 before buying the V35. With the special finance deal they had at the time and the depreciation, it was pretty reasonable from the cost standpoint. The warranty covers everything except gas and oil and the dealer was throwing in the first couple annuals.

I wanted more speed and more space, so I went for the Bonanza.

Using my cost spreadsheets from the V35, the DA40 would have cost me about 10k more per year after the big bonus from depreciation. Considering that it's worth 4x as much as my Bonanza, that's not a bad deal...

Edit: It was a consideration to my business sense.. but, my heart could never have let me own a plastic airplane with a straight tail...

I did my multi in a DA-42 and loved it. I can't think of a better plane to just get in the air with (I need two engines to feel comfortable). The visibility is amazing. With the FADEC engines it is extremely simple to fly.

I would love to find a partner or two to buy one with.

On the other hand the 42 is not a great trip plane. I imagine they are trying to change that with the 62. We'll see how it compares to a G58.

That's interesting feedback Spencer. Could you elaborate on that? What specifically makes you say that? Room? Baggage space? UL? Speed? Range?