07 May 2025, 01:14 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 03 Sep 2020, 02:21 |
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Joined: 06/17/14 Posts: 5850 Post Likes: +2627 Location: KJYO
Aircraft: C-182, GA-7
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It's funny how they call it or label it a "jet fuel engine" on the advertisement!
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 03 Sep 2020, 02:57 |
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Joined: 08/05/16 Posts: 3137 Post Likes: +2282 Company: Tack Mobile Location: KBJC
Aircraft: C441
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Username Protected wrote: It's funny how they call it or label it a "jet fuel engine" on the advertisement! It’s an accurate description. For those that aren’t familiar with Diamond, this is basically just a single engine 62. If they could pressurize this and the 62, it would be a very interesting airplane. Would only need 3.8psi to get to upper teens.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 03 Sep 2020, 06:10 |
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Joined: 01/05/11 Posts: 316 Post Likes: +227
Aircraft: 1969 Aerostar 600,
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Username Protected wrote: It's funny how they call it or label it a "jet fuel engine" on the advertisement! It’s an accurate description. For those that aren’t familiar with Diamond, this is basically just a single engine 62. If they could pressurize this and the 62, it would be a very interesting airplane. Would only need 3.8psi to get to upper teens. Pressurization adds weight. That’s something Diamond aircraft cannot afford considering they’re already at the underpowered end of the spectrum and they’re current useful load is not all that great. If you want to maintain performance after adding more weight you will need bigger engines, more fuel and a bigger airframe to house those bigger engines and more fuel. You see where this is going, right? Throw in a brs and you do not have any room for human beings and cost has yet to be addressed.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 03 Sep 2020, 09:32 |
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Joined: 07/29/12 Posts: 360 Post Likes: +151 Location: Augsburg , Europe (EDMQ)
Aircraft: 2008 Bonanza G36TN
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Username Protected wrote: And 48 foot wings. HK36 glider roots...
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 03 Sep 2020, 14:24 |
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Joined: 08/05/16 Posts: 3137 Post Likes: +2282 Company: Tack Mobile Location: KBJC
Aircraft: C441
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Username Protected wrote: If they could pressurize this and the 62, it would be a very interesting airplane. Would only need 3.8psi to get to upper teens. Pressurization adds weight. That’s something Diamond aircraft cannot afford considering they’re already at the underpowered end of the spectrum and they’re current useful load is not all that great. If you want to maintain performance after adding more weight you will need bigger engines, more fuel and a bigger airframe to house those bigger engines and more fuel. You see where this is going, right? Throw in a brs and you do not have any room for human beings and cost has yet to be addressed.
The useful load in the 62 is about 1,565 lbs– when you say that isn't that great, what are you comparing it to? I can't think of an airplane in this class that can match that. Baron, SR22T, Matrix or M350, all carry less. A G Baron I suppose is the closest comparison and the payload after adding an equivalent range of fuel is much less.
I believe the developed that fuselage with different doors to enable pressurization, and I don't think pressurizing it would at all that much weight, especially at something modest like 3.8psi which is all it would take for comfortable flying in the upper teens where those engines shine.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 03 Sep 2020, 15:48 |
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Joined: 10/14/14 Posts: 1773 Post Likes: +2008 Company: Corporate Air Technology
Aircraft: Pa28-235
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The fancy paint scheme helps. The DA aircraft are efficient but cosmetically challenged to my eye. Like an evening gown designed by and engineer.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 03 Sep 2020, 22:57 |
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Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11068 Post Likes: +7094 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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Username Protected wrote: It needs a parachute. You’d think after 20 years of aircraft builders getting their @$$es handed to them by Cirrus they would figure it out. You either want to sell one airplane per day or you don’t. Not putting a parachute on the 50 tells me they don’t want to sell a whole lot. Brand new engine technology makes me want a parachute even more.
Man's a genius!!! Shawn I'm with you, simply amazed that they don't add this
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 04 Sep 2020, 06:34 |
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Joined: 01/05/11 Posts: 316 Post Likes: +227
Aircraft: 1969 Aerostar 600,
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I’m pretty sure the existing cockpit and canopy structure would not adequately provide the necessary strength required to support pressurization. It’s not just throwing in a little bit of plumbing and all of a sudden you have pressurization. There’s a lot more thought, parts, pieces and components that have to be installed. All of this adds weight and cost. A pressurized windshield for the Aerostar alone is I believe in the neighborhood of 25g’s. Not inexpensive. I can’t imagine what a pressurized canopy for the Diamond series of aircraft would cost not including upgrading the airframe.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 04 Sep 2020, 07:22 |
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Joined: 01/30/09 Posts: 6025 Post Likes: +3388 Location: Oklahoma City, OK (KPWA)
Aircraft: planeless
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Username Protected wrote: t’s not just throwing in a little bit of plumbing and all of a sudden you have pressurization. There’s a lot more thought, parts, pieces and components that have to be installed. All of this adds weight and cost. Peter told me it's pretty easy.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 04 Sep 2020, 07:27 |
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Joined: 11/25/11 Posts: 9015 Post Likes: +17213 Location: KGNF, Grenada, MS
Aircraft: Baron, 180,195,J-3
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Overall, I'm impressed but not enough. I won't delve into the shortcomings, others have already done that, except one, that I will mention last.
The airplane, built with the access to unimaginable technology over what was available even twenty years ago, truly does not out shine the Bonanza, built with seventy year old technology by much. Though offered side by side, I would take the Diamond over a new 36 hands down.
My take, is that the airplane "almost" makes it in every respect. "Almost" doesn't cut much when your talking about a near one million dollar purchase which is what I would expect when it really goes "out the door" to the initial customer.
The biggest drawback will be what I assume is an unproven engine. The Mooney dealer from who I bought my Bravo was the Diamond dealer as well. I flew one of the first twins right after they came out and was tempted. Thank goodness I did not make that mistake. Engine issues made ownership for early purchasers a pure night mare with about as much support from Diamond as Trump got from Al Sharpton.
The airplane, as presented, won't succeed. The Cirrus will continue to kick ass in spite of the "brand obsessed" naysayers with a twenty year history of being wrong.
Jg
_________________ Waste no time with fools. They have nothing to lose.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 04 Sep 2020, 07:54 |
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Joined: 01/05/11 Posts: 316 Post Likes: +227
Aircraft: 1969 Aerostar 600,
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When you buy a brand new airplane you are really not buying an airplane first, or, you should not be. You are buying support network and history first. Your brand new airplane means nothing if it’s constantly in the shop, waiting for parts, or, both. If the manufacturer has a really good support history then your new purchase is good as gold. Diamond has anything but good support history. Not all of it is Diamond’s fault. I have yet to see the diesel making any kind of substantial inroads in the U.S. despite decades of trying. It’s just not happening. By the way John, I would take a new 36 in a heart beat over a Diamond. I used to be a fan of composites. I no longer am. That being said, I do have 1,200 hrs. in a DA40, G1000, WAAS, synthetic, GFC700. The technology is beyond incredible. It was nothing short of a joy to fly. I needed more useful load and speed. The Diamond twins just didn’t cut it for me.
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Post subject: Re: Diamond 50 RG Posted: 04 Sep 2020, 08:23 |
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Joined: 11/25/11 Posts: 9015 Post Likes: +17213 Location: KGNF, Grenada, MS
Aircraft: Baron, 180,195,J-3
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Username Protected wrote: When you buy a brand new airplane you are really not buying an airplane first, or, you should not be. You are buying support network and history first. Your brand new airplane means nothing if it’s constantly in the shop, waiting for parts, or, both. If the manufacturer has a really good support history then your new purchase is good as gold. Diamond has anything but good support history. Not all of it is Diamond’s fault. I have yet to see the diesel making any kind of substantial inroads in the U.S. despite decades of trying. It’s just not happening. By the way John, I would take a new 36 in a heart beat over a Diamond. I used to be a fan of composites. I no longer am. That being said, I do have 1,200 hrs. in a DA40, G1000, WAAS, synthetic, GFC700. The technology is beyond incredible. It was nothing short of a joy to fly. I needed more useful load and speed. The Diamond twins just didn’t cut it for me. Tom, Sometimes I have to laugh at myself. Without being direct, you pointed out a huge contradiction in my post. The Diamond, as presented, would be a more desirable airplane to me than a new Bonanza. But! with an unproven engine and proven weakness of Diamond support, I would not consider the Diamond at all. Add to you your side. Jg 
_________________ Waste no time with fools. They have nothing to lose.
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