12 Nov 2025, 18:29 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300  Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 15:43 |
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Joined: 01/29/08
Posts: 26338
Post Likes: +13085
Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
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Username Protected wrote: what percentage of airplanes are blocked vs not
I never show up on flightaware The same percentage as all others. It's not like P180's would be blocked more than all other airplanes. The math still works.
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 16:37 |
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Joined: 07/01/17
Posts: 64
Post Likes: +32
Location: Irvine, CA
Aircraft: DA-42-NG
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I saw a P180 II land at KHHR and the whole family piled out (was an owner/pilot situation).
It was awesome to see it land and hear the noises it makes.
I'm a big P180 fan from a technical and packaging perspective, but I am a P180 skeptic in terms of factory support here in the states.
I can't see a reason why one would buy much of any competing King Air or light jet in similar performance category vs. a P180 except for factory support concerns, and so given the (lack of) market penetration of the product I naturally come to the conclusion the issue must be: Factory support concerns.
*edit: There is also one that flies out of KLUK quite frequently and makes a wonderful hell of a racket in the process, I believe it is a corporate owned one.
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 16:47 |
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Joined: 08/14/13
Posts: 6410
Post Likes: +5147
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Username Protected wrote: what percentage of airplanes are blocked vs not
I never show up on flightaware The same percentage as all others. It's not like P180's would be blocked more than all other airplanes. The math still works.
i'm not being argumentative with you, but i'll point out that the more expensive the airplane, the more likely it is to be blocked
comparing the percentage of 172's that are blocked to the % of GIV's that are blocked is not apples/apples, the P180 is not a cheap plane
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 18:33 |
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Joined: 08/09/08
Posts: 1587
Post Likes: +219
Company: Future Health
Location: Sydney, Australia (YSBK)
Aircraft: 1967 Debonair C33
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Username Protected wrote: I never eee P180s anywhere in real life of FlightAware. I love them but it’s not realistic Look up METAL. Seems to be flying with little shop time Sitting in my house in Sydney I can tell when it flies over because of its distinct high pitch prop whine. Not much support infrastructure in Australia, especially in Coffs Harbour but it seems to fly.
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 19:51 |
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Joined: 01/29/08
Posts: 26338
Post Likes: +13085
Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
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Username Protected wrote:
i'm not being argumentative with you, but i'll point out that the more expensive the airplane, the more likely it is to be blocked
comparing the percentage of 172's that are blocked to the % of GIV's that are blocked is not apples/apples, the P180 is not a cheap plane
You don't sound like you've spent too much time tracking aircraft types on FA. I'm never looking at 172's or GV's. There are plenty of GV's not blocked btw. What does "tracking" and "airframe value" have to do with one another? P180's can be had for less then $1MM. Flying right now: 93 C208 Cessna Caravan 55 PC12 Pilatus PC-12 49 C172 Cessna Skyhawk 41 BE20 Beechcraft Super King Air 200 23 E55P Embraer Phenom 300 16 SR22 Cirrus SR-22 11 GLF4 Gulfstream Aerospace Gulfstream IV 11 C25B Cessna Citation CJ3 5 C25C Cessna Citation CJ4 5 C510 Cessna Citation Mustang 5 EA50 Eclipse 500 1 P180 Piaggio P.180 Avanti So you're saying P180's are blocked because they're expensive and Cessna Caravans are not blocked because they're cheap?
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 19:53 |
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Joined: 01/29/08
Posts: 26338
Post Likes: +13085
Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
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Username Protected wrote: Sitting in my house in Sydney I can tell when it flies over because of its distinct high pitch prop whine. Not much support infrastructure in Australia, especially in Coffs Harbour but it seems to fly. Indeed, according to FA there is 1 flying. Unfortunately, that's not enough to keep world wide service techs employed.
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 21:37 |
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Joined: 09/07/13
Posts: 511
Post Likes: +370
Location: Louisiana
Aircraft: K35 Bonanza
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Username Protected wrote: TAS at FL450 is 344. She's no a screamer up high. Yeah, but she has ramp appeal, I'll bet a guy could round up a few "screamers"to ride in the back! Lol! [color=#00FFBF][/color]
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 25 Sep 2018, 22:11 |
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Joined: 06/17/14
Posts: 6016
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Location: KJYO
Aircraft: C-182, GA-7
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I spend a bit of time under the flight path at Dulles. I only hear one or two Avantis a day since Avantair went under. Also, it is only a $2.2M price difference between a new Phenom 300 and Avanti 180 EVO.
When picking up friends or colleagues at Dulles, Manassas or Leesburg, there is usually a Phenom at IAD or HEF but rarely an Avanti. Two friends I learned to fly with work for or own a 135 operation and they are either buying a Citation, Phenom, Pilatus PC-12 and one is on the list for a 24. They didn’t even buy any of the used Avantis and one owns a maintenance shop. That tells me something.
The only oddity I notice about the Phenom is that sometimes they need turned around if there is more than a stiff breeze. The Citations and Avantis did not need that. A KingAir seems to be able to start in any weather but that is because Beechcraft are awesome!
In fact, Wheels Up and their KingAir fleet seems to be filling the gap that Avantair left.
This is just one aviation bums perspective. I spend most of my time in the back or jumpseat now.
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 26 Sep 2018, 09:06 |
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Joined: 06/10/12
Posts: 312
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Aircraft: CE500, 525, 650, Cub
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Username Protected wrote: TAS at FL450 is 344. She's no a screamer up high. I'm not a fan of the phenom but 344 TAS at F450?? That doesn't sound right. The CJ3 I manage is 405 TAS at F450 on 800lbs /hr, and the CJ4 I fly is 425 at F450 on 1000lbs/hr. 
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 26 Sep 2018, 09:10 |
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Joined: 07/01/11
Posts: 69
Post Likes: +30
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Username Protected wrote: TAS at FL450 is 344. She's no a screamer up high. I'm not a fan of the phenom but 344 TAS at F450?? That doesn't sound right. The CJ3 I manage is 405 TAS at F450 on 800lbs /hr, and the CJ4 I fly is 425 at F450 on 1000lbs/hr.
I'm surprised no one has corrected this yet. I fly a 100, and the guys I know who fly a 300 tell me to expect around 400TAS at FL450 or so.
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 26 Sep 2018, 09:55 |
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Joined: 01/29/08
Posts: 26338
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Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
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Username Protected wrote: I'm surprised no one has corrected this yet. I fly a 100, and the guys I know who fly a 300 tell me to expect around 400TAS at FL450 or so. That's not what the posted video shows. Fast forward to 13:47. Here's a west bound 300 and FL440 showing 392 Knots GS. Maybe the one in the video hadn't sped up yet? https://flightaware.com/live/flight/XSR ... Y/tracklog
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 26 Sep 2018, 10:08 |
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Joined: 10/05/09
Posts: 1170
Post Likes: +449
Location: Charleston, SC (KJZI)
Aircraft: Phenom 300, Bell 505
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Book speed at ISA and FL450 is 415K True at 880lb/hr. In my experience with the 100 the book numbers are incredibly accurate down to the knot and lb.
Typically you leave the throttles in CLB until reaching your cruise speed but at FL450 there isn't going to be much difference between CLB and CRZ so it will take a few minutes to speed up; perhaps 5 - 10.
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Post subject: Re: Phenom 300 Posted: 26 Sep 2018, 10:26 |
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Joined: 08/14/13
Posts: 6410
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Username Protected wrote:
i'm not being argumentative with you, but i'll point out that the more expensive the airplane, the more likely it is to be blocked
comparing the percentage of 172's that are blocked to the % of GIV's that are blocked is not apples/apples, the P180 is not a cheap plane
You don't sound like you've spent too much time tracking aircraft types on FA. I'm never looking at 172's or GV's. There are plenty of GV's not blocked btw. So you're saying P180's are blocked because they're expensive and Cessna Caravans are not blocked because they're cheap?
I actually run a few PiAwares in Georgia and Florida, and I see aircraft that never make it to flight aware, I see the raw stats and percentages next to the "worlds busiest airport" as well as the outlying PDK and FTY corporate airports
The flightaware numbers you post, and post often, are flawed- I do not think you know how the data is aggregated or what criteria places them on the publicly accessible sites versus the raw data feeds.
If your tail number is blocked, with FAA and Flightaware, your aircraft type can still be seen through their raw data feed service which is subscription based, for ADS-B targets this will be hit or miss, for IFR it will be a solid reliable feed, but either way, the percentage of blocked versus non blocked aircraft is greater than 60% on my feeders.
I fully expect the smartass "Okay so possibly 2 P180's are flying now" response from you in keeping with your character, however, the fact remains it isn't that simple
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