Holy flaps! I think I counted (3) flap elements on the inboard section. I used to design flap mechanisms, so I have some appreciation for how difficult it must have been to design that system. Did you also see the giant spoilers that deploy upon landing? It's amazing that it can achieve such short field capability without thrust reversers but it's clear that the flaps and spoilers are key to such a short stopping distance.

Nice design Pilatus!

Yeah that thing has what looks like 2/3 span (80% area?) flaps and spoilers. The spoiler system is interesting - looks like two small outboard flight spoilers and two LARGE inboard ground spoilers. Any thoughts why the deploy outer flight > outer ground > inner flight > inner ground? Looks fast enough that it's automated, but it's definitely sequential.

Tom,
Why do you think insurers are hesitant to insure owner flown aircraft with these higher hull values? The last 4 fatal accidents with the PC12 have been flown by pro pilots. I understand for some reason there seem to be a higher number of accidents with owner flown aircraft that are sub 2m hull but over that, is there really a difference in accident rates between owner and pro flown? Maybe its the training investment is a smaller overall % of the aircraft value, I'm not sure but accident rates seem to be lower with the higher valued aircraft.

I suspect there will be very few exclusively owner flown PC24s anyway.

CJ4 accidents.

Howell, MI runway overrun, total loss.

Cleveland, OH loss of control on departure (6 fatal).

Both owner flown in high dollar airplanes.

Mike C.

Not unlike the Mitsubishi Diamond (aka Beech 400).

Big flaps help landing, they don't necessarily make takeoff that much better though.

In the video, note that we don't know the weight, winds, temps, altitude. Also note they surely didn't cross runway threshold at 50 ft, more like 2 ft. Published numbers are going to be from 50 ft TCH. The standard reference number is 0 MSL, ISA, no wind, max landing weight, 50 ft TCH, and *zero* pilot error on Vref, plus level, dry, paved runway.

Pilatus web page numbers:

Takeoff: 2810 ft (assumes engine failure at V1, over 35 ft obstacle)

Landing: 2355 ft (from 50 ft)

Mike C.

Hi Brent-
Mike C hit on two notable losses that I feel moved the underwriting carrier's needle a little bit over the last year. Further there are several underwriting companies who participate heavily in the owner/flown turbine/jet market and they are capped at $5m or $6m insured value due to re-insurance treaties. Another carrier we do a lot of light jet transition insurance with has a significant rate change when the hull value exceeds $3m (Again due to their reinsurance).

A good number of the legacy insurers don't generally have an appetite for higher hull value single-pilot owner flown jet transitions (companies like USAIG, Allianz, Global Aerospace, AIG etc). This all adds up to a very narrow market in some cases (depending on the risk) when you are talking about a $9m+ hull value on a jet transition risk.

I think other brokers have also hit on this topic on this board - but I saw perhaps one of the worst claims years with my customers in recent memory respects turbines - FOD, Prop Strikes, Hail Damage, Lightning Strikes etc etc. A lot of these events don't make the news and some don't appear in the statistics that are published concerning safety records etc.

The insurance market overall in some segments is as soft as it has ever been but in other segments with the hull values continuing to rise on owner/flown turbine equipment - the market I feel isn't going to support exceptionally low premiums and high limits of liability. I think insurance will almost always be able to be procured for a jet transition into a $9m+ aircraft but it may come with additional hurdles in the current market and also at a disproportionate cost.

The SJ30 publishes a landing distance at max gross of 2585 ft. It has a sophisticated wing with both leading edge devices (which I really like to see a jet have, but is rare in the light jet crop), and a lot of flaps.

The SJ30 is a really intriguing airplane for the owner pilot. Long range, very fast, incredible cabin pressure differential. While not really a competitor to the PC24 (which has probably double the seats), it is an example of aggressive design for performance. But alas, I think the company is spinning its wheels.

If I get my Multi Commercial...... Why is an owner operator not considered a "pro pilot"?

Love the SJ30 and am rooting for it. It just came a little too early for the VLJ revolution, was on a little too shaky ground and has a cabin that's just a little too small for widespread adoption. But performance-wise, nothing can touch it 25 years later. Nor it's looks - this is the original supermodel.

I hope they can bring the SJ30i to market soon.

You're the BT cheerleader for every plane that doesn't really exist.

Just guessing here, but I imagine the "professional pilot" moniker goes to pilots that 1) get paid to fly as their profession, and, 2) Operate under some sort of "standards" manual and formal training/safety (SMS) program (corporate guys) or commercial FAR Part like 91K, 125, 121, 135, etc.

Your skills, ability or approach to aircraft operation probably have little bearing on being considered a "pro pilot" to the insurance world.

BWTHDIK

George

PS If you want your Comm MEL come see me, it's what I do. It's one of the easiest tickets to get.

Just guessing here, but I imagine the "professional pilot" moniker goes to pilots that 1) get paid to fly as their profession, and, 2) Operate under some sort of "standards" manual and formal training/safety (SMS) program (corporate guys) or commercial FAR Part like 91K, 125, 121, 135, etc.

Your skills, ability or approach to aircraft operation probably have little bearing on being considered a "pro pilot" to the insurance world.

BWTHDIK

George

PS If you want your Comm MEL come see me, it's what I do. It's one of the easiest tickets to get.

You also have to spend 6 hrs before every flight in the pilots lounge drinking FBO coffee, watching Fox News and bitching about liberals. That's the only way to get the discount.