Jens,

We've done it once with no issues. Are you using a service center or at least someone with Avanti maintenance manuals?

Service Center over here in Germany.

Hi Jens,

My maintenance shop (SAI Flight support at GMU) swapped my tires last time.
I had ordered two new tires. When they came in and I had plane in for service they looked at tires and said we can swap them. I flew for probably twenty more landings then put the new tires on. The Labor to just swap the tires was significantly higher than I expected and of course had to pay labor again next time to put on the new tires.

I am ordering new tires this morning. Tread is a bit too low on right side to swap.

Have you tried doing it yourself? The Avanti may need special equipment but I found on my Mitsubishi and the two prior Aerostars that having the equipment in the hangar to do the tires allows you to complete the job locally on your own time schedule. A floor jack, air compressor, manual tire dismounting tool and motorcycle tire balancing tool with weights are what you need. I always swap mine before putting on new retreads and it certainly extends tire life.

Swapping mounted tires left to right for body gear like the MU2 or P180 won't do much good. That gear swings in such a way as to change the tilt of the tire, so the first contact edge is the same whether the tire is on the left or the right side.

To get even wear, you have to dismount the tire and flip it around on the wheel so the what was the outside edge is now the inside edge. This is labor intensive since it requires wheel disassembly (which may trigger NDT on some planes), and rebalancing.

There's no value to doing this on my Citation since the tire doesn't tilt with gear travel.

Mike C.

The recco I was told is when inside two tread lines are almost smooth, swap.

I have done 2x since purchasing plane.

You need big wing jacks or a specialized puck jack.

I have tried every permutation of floor jack I could fine and none are secure enough or they hit the brake. Part of issue is gear slides as you jack it. You also need greased plates for when you lower plane back off jacks.

If you have wing jacks, it’s incredible easy.

Note - the book says you are supposed to NDT wheel with every tire change now. And bolts are replaced every time.

Yes, you have to remove and remount the tire when you move it so the inside becomes the outside and vice-versa. This also keeps them rotating in the same direction.

My Citation wears the inside more than the outside and I have heard that is common. I know there are alignment procedures in the MM but my mechanic flat out told me he won't do it. He said that he has wasted more time trying to even out the wear on Citations that he's not doing it any more. I had been told that in the past it wasn't worth the labor to swap them but with the current prices and challenges with availability it can make sense. It cost me 3 hours of labor total. Only requires new "packing" (what Cessna calls an o ring) to seal the 2 halves of the wheel, visual corrosion inspection, and regreasing the bearings. I did it last year and am enjoying continued flights as I wait on my replacements (that I ordered over a year ago).

But it sounds like dismounting the tire will trigger more inspections on the P180 than on my plane. If P180 tires are readily available it may not be worth it.

Sounds like he doesn't do it right.

It isn't that hard. You simply adjust the rod end on the gear actuator until the wheel meets the required angle. Note that it isn't vertical, and I suspect mechanics don't notice that nuance and leave it set wrong which leads to more wear. I don't know why it isn't exactly vertical, but Textron has probably figured out the best setting.

If the wheel camber is not per spec, you are putting higher side loads into your gear system that if it was, so this is not just about tire wear.

Also, you can check toe in at the same time. Bad toe in can wear out tires quickly.


You bet.

The Goodyear 265K08-1 for P180 seems constrained right now, much like my 220K28-1 main tires ($1200/each now!).

I wish Michelin would return to making tires for Citations like they used to. The Goodyear tires aren't really that good.
Sigh.

Mike C.

FWIW, I just bought a couple Michelin 028-357-0 (6.50x10 12 ply 190mph) for P180. $500 each, which doesn't seem ridiculous given the general market.

I ordered mine today and shop said they should arrive by Wednesday.
I don't think I will be swapping anymore just to get another twenty or so landings given the labor expense of swapping.

To any perspective pilots following this thread and contemplating buying an Avanti or maybe something else....why o WHY o WHY would you set yerself up for disappointment buying something else.

Parts and maintenance are available and....

Avanti does NOT break every 100 hours

Still grinning

Yes. By “swap” I mean swap sides on the tire. Put the part of the tire that is outside on the inside. That’s why you use the manual bead breaker prior to splitting the wheel and then re-balancing it . I have never tried putting the left tire on the right because as Mike C suggested, the wear pattern would remain the same. Plus, to do that, you’d need two floor jacks and it might be safer to have true wing jacks for such a job.

People who say it doesn’t work on P180, clearly don’t own one.

Rotating doubles landing life. It’s a function of the tire sliding during gear compression. It’s dramatic enough you cannot lower plane off jacks without setting it down on grease plates.

When my inner groves were worn off, outer ones perfect. I rotated and got almost same number of cycles out. The outer edges of tire just get almost zero wear.

I owned an mu2 as well, zero comparison. The p180 gear design is quite different and the tire angle at touchdown much more

I am referring to rotating tire, not wheel !

Those who say it’s not worth the labor to rotate, i believe the labor is the same whether you buy two new tires and put them on or rotate the two existing tires. So… you might as well not spend on two new tires half the time, right?

As for the jacking, if you have one spare tire somewhere you could get away with using a small floor jack, change one tire, then move the one that just came off to the opposite side. Jacking these things does seem to require a couple jacks of unusual height. The jacks I have for the Mits are actually a hair too tall to get under the wing.

Two words: oxyacetylene torch.

Mike C.

Those who say it’s not worth the labor to rotate, i believe the labor is the same whether you buy two new tires and put them on or rotate the two existing tires. So… you might as well not spend on two new tires half the time, right?