I just don't know how these threads turn into these pissing matches, constantly. Mike thinks Chip promotes too much and he shouldn't as he's an advertiser. They've been bickering on here as long as I'm around.

Chip doesn't think so and thinks Mike chimes in on everything. Okay he does and well, that's been happening since I've been on here.

Just crazy to me how much energy you two must waste thinking about each other and responding to each other's posts.

Imagine if all BT sponsors (about 100 long) did the same.

It would be like watching infomercials all night.

Is that what you want BT to become?

No way Mike C self promotes his business on airplane forums. That’s nuts.

I put my business and personal IG links in my signature to share who I am and what I do. It’s more of a personal connection thing. Technically by doing that I may seem to be self promoting but that’s not the case. I do not have and have never sold anything to a person I met on forums. But I have had guys see I race Offroad and reach out to say hi. That’s pretty cool and why I do it.

I do feel like many of Chips post are to help his business interests. And for me
That’s fine. He is a sponsor and technically helps make this forum possible. My issue is when Chip attacks guys like Mike and I that are not his business demographic. This often starts the wasteful bickering.

It’s hard to understand other peoples perspective and value system. Which is why there is so many arguments about it.

I do agree with Mike C that if all 100 sponsors posted like Chip it would be a problem. I would most likely not come here and filter thru it. So there is a balance.

Mike

I don't "attack" anyone because they are not in my business demographic... that is just plain silly. First of all, I'm currently handling an acquisition for an aircraft very much like Mike's, so his aircraft is clearly in my demographic... you would be likely to upgrade to something similar, so you'd fit as well.

I think part of the issue is I'm not on here pandering for business, even though that's the accusation, I suspect some folks would like it better if I was a sales guy or maybe a politician, kissing butts and kissing babies... sorry, that isn't me.

I just want to see people who buy airplanes, people like you and people like Mike, be able to buy airplanes without getting screwed. Aircraft brokerage is completely unregulated, there's no barrier to entry, no training, no licensing... it's the wild west.

My goal is to provide solid, truthful information.

I do get riled when people post false, incomplete or misleading information about aircraft operating cost, so if I have "attacked" anyone, that is likely why.

Which is why I mention the lack of regulation, using deception to sell airplanes should be illegal.

Totally off topic, Chip and Mike... I mean market for airplanes....

We'd love to get a SETP but live in SE Florida and wondering about these compressor washes we would have to do after every flight, or the warranty is void. What's the real deal on that and how often to really have to do them.

http://www.nobusinesstopromote.commm (<--Not real, tongue in cheek)

Compressor washes done correctly, with the correct water and solution are probably the best thing you can do for a turbine engine... done improperly, probably the worst.

Every flight seems excessive, but considering the salt content in the air down there, I guess I could see it.

Sometimes we forget that we're talking about a million dollar machine, not the airplane... the engine!

I'm interested to see what the engine experts say, and what Mike has to say, I suspect he has done extensive research on this subject.

I got curious and looked at their Q2 results. Even without digging too deeply... $335m in revenue with $328m cost of revenue, so 2% gross margins before any other expenses. Ouch.

Mike is worried about vendors clogging up Beechtalk... and the number of threads I start...

I think BT has the opposite problem, lack of content.

Don't get me wrong, it is better than most, but there's only so much to be said about airplanes. That's why the most popular threads are actually under Babble Talk. The Covid period had to be the most interaction (good and bad) ever experienced at Beechtalk.

Some come here for info, more come for entertainment.

To answer Sal’s question, I flew an M600 with a PT6 for five years out of the Tampa area, and often into south Florida. Compressor rinses were completed once a month. When I sold the plane the engine was inspected and found to have zero corrosion issues. I’m currently flying a TBM and completing washes with the same frequency. A lot of it is common sense. If you fly in and out of the Bahamas or other islands frequently then I would do rinses more frequently, or at least after getting back from a trip.

As I recall, most of the engines I worked on had a schedule for wash, either being every 100 hours or so, or when turbine temps were trending higher at a set N1 (the rationale being a dirty compressor was aerodynamically less efficient requiring more work from the turbine to reach the desired fan speed).

The only customer that utilized a more frequent wash schedule (approx every three days as I recall) was the US Coast Guard, which literally had planes sitting in saltwater at certain bases (like Miami).

I’d be curious which engine manufacturer and model is recommending a daily wash.

As an aside, back in the day we had a number of different methods for doing the wash routine. One apparatus was a wand that extended into the inlet (biz jet application), with a cuff conforming to the leading edge (and held down with sandbags). A concept we developed and tested (but never made into production) was a manifold built into the fan frame with a quick disconnect on the nacelle.

Today, your biggest issue may be environmental restrictions which many airports have with running the wash fluid onto the tarmac. For this reason, Pratt devised their EcoWash system, which captures and recycles the wash solution. If you’ve got a million, you can probably persuade Pratt to part with one. Otherwise, you may need to find a local vendor who has a unit.

Art

My JT15D-5A maintenance manual has no prescribed wash schedule that I have found. In chapter 71-00-00, it has both compressor wash and turbine wash procedures which are quite complex in terms of equipment and process, including solution tank, rinse tank, various valves and timers, etc. I've never seen it in use anywhere.

The recommendation (not an inspection or scheduled task) is to do these washes weekly when the plane is in salt or smog environments. My plane is in neither being based in the Midwest, so it doesn't get washes. Flying through rain occasionally probably maintains things decently enough but that doesn't happen very often for me, maybe once or twice a year.

I've noticed no N2 or ITT creep since owning the plane, so things seem stable.


PWC says for JT15D-5A compressor wash:

Continuously salt/smog laden: Recommended after last flight of day. Wash frequency may be optimized based on operator's
experience.

The effort to do that seems ridiculous.

Compressor washes do not seem to be routine for the JT15D engines and they seem to have few corrosion issues. If anybody has additional guidance, let me know.

The PW500 series, PW600 series, and the FJ44 seem more sensitive to this.

Mike C.

Thanks Jack, should have asked you that during our phone call!

You’re welcome, Sal. Good luck with your decision.

https://www.amazon.com/Amerex-Gallon-Wa ... g=btalk-20

This is what I use.

I suggest that manufacturers are more sensitive to the CYA environment than they used to be, and newer models with more recently published maintenance procedures have more detailed maintenance requirements so that manufacturers can point fingers elsewhere when a warranty claim occurs.

My 1965 toaster did not include a warning about inserting forks.