Wager accepted.

My nominated charity is Alzheimer's Association: alz.org.

You might as well write the check now and get it on this year's taxes.

Mike C.

Wager accepted.

My nominated charity is Alzheimer's Association: alz.org.

You might as well write the check now and get it on this year's taxes.

Mike C.

Which are relatively cheap because, guess what, they are kind of lackluster on speed and range. The production of them basically stopped after the original owners upgraded and flooded the market with used ones. They made 8 new ones in 2014.

Allen has it right, the SF50 is the best marketing program for owner flown Citations in history. Anybody who really wants to travel in jet style won't find it with the SF50. It is like having a Yugo as your first car, you will want something else pretty quick.

Mike C.

Sorta ... New mostly sells for tax reasons or for capability (or just availability) not available in the used market. And yes, some people want _NEW_, but most people just are happy with like new. 2-5 years old vs. new isn't a big deal. Textron's efforts to kill the legacy fleet suggests new mfrs. see used as competition.

As for tech wizard - that was perhaps shorthand for the guy about to solo with a few million burning a hole in his pocket. Yes, the ones with an Android won't buy an SF50, but the iPhone guys will.

The Mustang achieved Cessna's objective of getting new entry buyers into the bottom of the Citation line. If the SF50 delivers a new wave of buyers then it will drive more demand. If buyers want more Mustangs built then Cessna will build them.

We now have around 1000 twin engine turbojets - Mustangs, Phenom 100, Eclipse - between the $1MM to $2.5MM price point that previously didn't exist. We will see how the SF50 fits into that price point.

I have found no one at Textron or who used to be at Textron who confirms that theory. It may look that way but their actions are motivated by other objectives such as profits and liability.

"Better" depends on the buyer's needs.

In 2014, Cirrus shipped 160 SR22T, Cessna shipped 155 172S. Cirrus also shipped 117 SR22, 31 SR20. For some things, a 172 is better.

If I was forced to buy a new piston traveling machine, I'd look at a Piper Malibu Mirage (37 shipped in 2014). Pressurization is a game changer for traveling.

If I was forced to buy a new unpressurized travel airplane, I'd look at the Corvalis (22 shipped in 2014) and the Cirrus. The higher performance of the Corvalis would be favored all things being equal.

If I wanted a new piston twin, Diamond DA40 (136 shipped in 2014) or Baron (40 shipped in 2014).

If I was looking for a fun airplane, the Carbon Cub (53 shipped in 2014), or maybe a Decathalon (17 shipped in 2014).

BTW, there were 40 Barons and 32 Bonanzas shipped in 2014. That's a new piston Beech every 3 working days, not exactly dead as a product line.

Mike C.

I have found no one at Textron or who used to be at Textron who confirms that theory. It may look that way but their actions are motivated by other objectives such as profits and liability.

40 or 42?

40 or 42?

I speculate the gear pivot pricing is to make the parts sale profitable on a stand alone basis. Many legacy Cessna parts are manufactured by others in small batches. So you have multiple layers of profits and liability costs.

Cessna does have a process for a customer to request a review of a parts price. And there have been times when such a review has lead them to adjust the price down significantly.

SID Program was clearly liability driven. Cessna got scared by some of the things they were hearing. Their engineers and lawyers felt they had to do something and we got typical corporate bureaucracy over reaction. It will play well in court in their defense.

Beech still manages to sell a few dozen bonanzas a year at $700K - all those parts are low volume too. No way any single part of a landing gear has to cost anywhere near $15k.

If you buy all the parts for a $30,000 Chevy it will cost something like $200,000. You get the package discount when you buy them all in one assembled bundle.

Parts distribution has its own inflated cost structure.

Wager accepted.

My nominated charity is Alzheimer's Association: alz.org.

You might as well write the check now and get it on this year's taxes.
posting.php?mode=quote&f=49&p=1561670#
Mike C.