06 Dec 2025, 06:25 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 28 Mar 2018, 15:00 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 05/02/15 Posts: 1010 Post Likes: +741 Location: Austin, Texas and Argentina
Aircraft: L-39 Albatros
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Building time is an old wives tale.
Learn to fly the plane you want to fly. Flying a TTX does not make flying a jet easier. Flying jets makes you better at flying jets. I think Chip might have been referring to me when he said "In fact I have a friend that is flying the stink out of a TTx to build total time." While flying a TTX may not make flying a jet easier, building time isn't a wive's tale in my case. I am building time to fly an L-39. The FAA requires 1000 hours to get the LOA to fly an L-39. So I am currently flying the piss out of my Columbia. I just flew from Texas to Argentina, where I'll fly around the country for a few months, and then I'll fly back to Texas around June. In 2015 I had 50 hours, now I have 700 (just 300 in the Columbia). During my next 250 hours, I plan to get my multi-engine ticket and do some aerobatics training (in a piston first). This is the advice I got from the guys flying the jet warbirds, and since I need 1000 hours anyway, I might as well make the most of it. I'm learning a ton along the way.
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 28 Mar 2018, 16:48 |
|
 |

|
|
Joined: 01/09/12 Posts: 1750 Post Likes: +2810 Company: MENA, LLC, (Retired Soldier) Location: Hampton, GA (South of Atlanta)
Aircraft: Shopping for a Beech
|
|
|
Chris,
Regarding building time. It seems to me that you are actually wasting time flying a 200 knot plus airplane. Why not fly the same routes in a SLOW plane, thus adding at least twice the time for each leg?
A Piper Cub, an Air Cam, an older 172/182 will get you there, take much longer and add much more time for your needs. An Air Cam has two additional benefits: It is multi engine AND a tail dragger. Your time would be gathered in a Multi and many Aircams are configured for IFR also.
Just a thought. Seems like your trip to Argentina could put you over the 1000 mark in a slower plane.
Martin
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 28 Mar 2018, 17:42 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 05/02/15 Posts: 1010 Post Likes: +741 Location: Austin, Texas and Argentina
Aircraft: L-39 Albatros
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Chris, Regarding building time. It seems to me that you are actually wasting time flying a 200 knot plus airplane. Why not fly the same routes in a SLOW plane, thus adding at least twice the time for each leg?
Good point Martin, I've considered the "go slow" option. I do have about 163 hours in C152's, 80 hours in C172's and 40 hours in a Piper Archer. My goal isn't absolute cheapest hours - I could do that by living in a hot air balloon for 3 weeks tied 20 feet above the ground, and I'd get 500 hours towards the required 1000!. (The FAA rule for jet warbirds says only 500 hours of the 1000 need to be fixed-wing). It's a balance between cost and enjoyment and just traveling. If I could log time in a paraglider or paramotor, I'd do that, but unfortunately that time doesn't count towards the 1000 (even thought you probably learn more about aerodynamics flying a paraglider than flying a TTX).
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 28 Mar 2018, 17:46 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 02/10/12 Posts: 6712 Post Likes: +8234 Company: Minister of Pith Location: Florida
Aircraft: Piper PA28/140
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Building time is an old wives tale.
Learn to fly the plane you want to fly. Flying a TTX does not make flying a jet easier. Flying jets makes you better at flying jets. I think Chip might have been referring to me when he said "In fact I have a friend that is flying the stink out of a TTx to build total time." While flying a TTX may not make flying a jet easier, building time isn't a wive's tale in my case. I am building time to fly an L-39. The FAA requires 1000 hours to get the LOA to fly an L-39. So I am currently flying the piss out of my Columbia. I just flew from Texas to Argentina, where I'll fly around the country for a few months, and then I'll fly back to Texas around June. In 2015 I had 50 hours, now I have 700 (just 300 in the Columbia). During my next 250 hours, I plan to get my multi-engine ticket and do some aerobatics training (in a piston first). This is the advice I got from the guys flying the jet warbirds, and since I need 1000 hours anyway, I might as well make the most of it. I'm learning a ton along the way. How do you look in a tux?
_________________ "No comment until the time limit is up."
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 28 Mar 2018, 20:27 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 05/01/14 Posts: 9780 Post Likes: +16721 Location: Операционный офис КГБ
Aircraft: TU-104
|
|
Username Protected wrote: I could do that by living in a hot air balloon for 3 weeks tied 20 feet above the ground, and I'd get 500 hours towards the required 1000!. (The FAA rule for jet warbirds says only 500 hours of the 1000 need to be fixed-wing). That would be a great story!
_________________ Be kinder than I am. It’s a low bar. Flight suits = superior knowledge
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 29 Mar 2018, 08:11 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 01/29/08 Posts: 26338 Post Likes: +13085 Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
|
|
Username Protected wrote: I am building time to fly an L-39. The FAA requires 1000 hours to get the LOA to fly an L-39. So I am currently flying the piss out of my Columbia. This is a "rule" made up by a government bureaucracy. It's not going to make you a better L39 pilot. There are a lot of ways to kill yourself in an L39 that have nothing to do with "total time". Flying old war birds is a completely different animal. I don't see the ROI in it.
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 29 Mar 2018, 08:13 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 01/29/08 Posts: 26338 Post Likes: +13085 Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Good point Martin, I've considered the "go slow" option. I do have about 163 hours in C152's, 80 hours in C172's and 40 hours in a Piper Archer. My goal isn't absolute cheapest hours - I could do that by living in a hot air balloon for 3 weeks tied 20 feet above the ground, and I'd get 500 hours towards the required 1000!. (The FAA rule for jet warbirds says only 500 hours of the 1000 need to be fixed-wing). It's a balance between cost and enjoyment and just traveling. If I could log time in a paraglider or paramotor, I'd do that, but unfortunately that time doesn't count towards the 1000 (even thought you probably learn more about aerodynamics flying a paraglider than flying a TTX). You're proving my point with this point.
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 29 Mar 2018, 08:52 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 08/15/11 Posts: 2610 Post Likes: +1214 Location: Mandan, ND
Aircraft: None currently
|
|
Username Protected wrote: The pilot of tomorrow buys a new Cirrus, gets his pilots license in it, and then with just a few hundred hours is ready and willing to fly anything the insurance company will allow him to fly.
I’m still grappling with this issue, but this is the new reality. And, other than those of us who did it the old way thinking it doesn’t “feel” right, is there any real evidence that says the new way is less safe?
Yeah...this.
A friend is looking to buy in to a SR22 with 2 local guys. One has PPL, the other nothing. The non-pilot owner wants to train in the SR22. People say "he can't do that!" As a CFI, I say "why not?". Good training is good training, done in a SR22 or C172.
My personal opinion is that starting out from scratch in a SR22 might be a steeper learning curve for the first few hours (solo?) than a C172. It might (depending on the individual) be quicker to go to solo in a C172, then transition to the SR22. Just so you know how a "simple and benign" plane flies. But going from scratch in a SR22 is totally valid.
It can't be harder than starting out in PT-17, then BT13 and then switching to T6...
Last edited on 29 Mar 2018, 09:02, edited 1 time in total.
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 29 Mar 2018, 09:01 |
|
 |

|
|
Joined: 11/03/08 Posts: 16927 Post Likes: +28751 Location: Peachtree City GA / Stoke-On-Trent UK
Aircraft: A33
|
|
|
Chris, i think you are spot on
put another way - can an SR22 pilot get to solo and even PPl faster if s/he does the PPL in a C172 ? Sure
But what is the fastest way to become a competent SR22 pilot flying IFR cross country trips? I'll wager that will happen fastest (and most proficient) by starting in the SR22 from scratch.
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 29 Mar 2018, 14:24 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 06/05/11 Posts: 386 Post Likes: +172 Location: Atlanta, GA
Aircraft: SR22
|
|
Username Protected wrote: A friend is looking to buy in to a SR22 with 2 local guys. One has PPL, the other nothing. The non-pilot owner wants to train in the SR22. People say "he can't do that!" As a CFI, I say "why not?". Good training is good training, done in a SR22 or C172. Insurance limits. You can get insurance, just maybe not as much as you'd like. I'm sure the training and learning would be fine. Might take a little more time, but not much. I have been working on setting up a co-ownership on SR22. Had one guy with 200-250 hrs and just starting on his IR and no SR22 time. There was a cap on the liability that the other two of us didn't want to have; I think it was $300k with sublimits. No, we couldn't get split liability, lower for him and higher for us. We wanted $1 million smooth or maybe even $2 million smooth.
_________________ Wayne
LinkedIn instagram: waynecease
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 29 Mar 2018, 14:40 |
|
 |

|
|
 |
Joined: 11/06/10 Posts: 12192 Post Likes: +3076 Company: Looking Location: Outside Boston, or some hotel somewhere
Aircraft: None
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Insurance limits. You can get insurance, just maybe not as much as you'd like.
I'm sure the training and learning would be fine. Might take a little more time, but not much.
I have been working on setting up a co-ownership on SR22. Had one guy with 200-250 hrs and just starting on his IR and no SR22 time. There was a cap on the liability that the other two of us didn't want to have; I think it was $300k with sublimits. No, we couldn't get split liability, lower for him and higher for us. We wanted $1 million smooth or maybe even $2 million smooth. I had no issue with no PPL and almost no time getting one mil smooth in 2009. It required a Cirrus certified instructor, and a minimum time of something like 60 hours before I could carry passengers. Note: this was a SR20. So instead of split limits, you may want to ask the question differently. Tim
|
|
| Top |
|
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: Cessna Ends TTX Production Posted: 01 Apr 2018, 11:42 |
|
 |

|
|
Joined: 07/04/11 Posts: 1709 Post Likes: +244 Company: W. John Gadd, Esq. Location: Florida
Aircraft: C55 Baron
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Building time is an old wives tale.
Learn to fly the plane you want to fly. Flying a TTX does not make flying a jet easier. Flying jets makes you better at flying jets. I think Chip might have been referring to me when he said "In fact I have a friend that is flying the stink out of a TTx to build total time." While flying a TTX may not make flying a jet easier, building time isn't a wive's tale in my case. I am building time to fly an L-39. The FAA requires 1000 hours to get the LOA to fly an L-39. So I am currently flying the piss out of my Columbia. I just flew from Texas to Argentina, where I'll fly around the country for a few months, and then I'll fly back to Texas around June. In 2015 I had 50 hours, now I have 700 (just 300 in the Columbia). During my next 250 hours, I plan to get my multi-engine ticket and do some aerobatics training (in a piston first). This is the advice I got from the guys flying the jet warbirds, and since I need 1000 hours anyway, I might as well make the most of it. I'm learning a ton along the way.
You need to get to posting some pics of your adventures.
|
|
| Top |
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum
|
Terms of Service | Forum FAQ | Contact Us
BeechTalk, LLC is the quintessential Beechcraft Owners & Pilots Group providing a
forum for the discussion of technical, practical, and entertaining issues relating to all Beech aircraft. These include
the Bonanza (both V-tail and straight-tail models), Baron, Debonair, Duke, Twin Bonanza, King Air, Sierra, Skipper, Sport, Sundowner,
Musketeer, Travel Air, Starship, Queen Air, BeechJet, and Premier lines of airplanes, turboprops, and turbojets.
BeechTalk, LLC is not affiliated or endorsed by the Beechcraft Corporation, its subsidiaries, or affiliates.
Beechcraft™, King Air™, and Travel Air™ are the registered trademarks of the Beechcraft Corporation.
Copyright© BeechTalk, LLC 2007-2025
|
|
|
|