Forgive my heresy but the Mooney will likely be easier on insurance for the new guy than the A36. Mooneys super easy to insure.

That's because they are so cramped that you rarely have passenger related claims.

As to 'how do you get out of a mooney' ? Usually with some back pain.

Isn't it like getting out of a go cart at the beach?

My bonanza buddies make fun of me but they are mysteriously quiet when I fill up for 200$ and it takes them 300$ for the same trip

Gene,

I hate to sound pretentious so sometimes, it's best not to "sound" at all. In this case, I will respond and hope no one thinks I'm trying to be condescending or sound like I'm Bob Hoover or Sky King.

I have accumulated a significant number of hours flying GA aircraft since I learned to fly at 11 years of age. Many, probably most of those hours are in Beech products including Bonanzas. Today, I fly a Mooney Bravo simply because nothing, absolutely nothing, can meet my flight profile requirements better or for less money.

Having an opinion, right or wrong, based upon experience, I will make these comments.

Of all the differences between a Bonanza and a Mooney, the landing gear is the most dramatic. With little modification, the Bonanza was turned into the T-34 Mentor and bashed into the ground by military trainees for a generation without meaningful problems. As for the Mooney, I would rate the gear the weak link of the model.

The differences go much farther than that though some comparisons lean in favor of the Mooney; particularly it's in-flight integrity. When someone asks me about the flying characteristics of a Mooney, my reply is that they are simply different. I would not hesitate to allow a really good stick and rudder pilot step from a Skylane to a Bonanza (though for obvious reasons I would not). A Bonanza is about as predictable and slop simple airplane in handling as has ever existed. The biggest issue is simply that the gear goes up.

On the other hand, the thought of a Cessna pilot stepping into a Mooney without lots of instruction would scare the crap out of me. Fly a Mooney, like a Mooney and it is a very good airplane. Fly it like a Cessna or Bonanza and you will die or at least bend lots of aluminum. The handling characteristics of the Mooney's laminar flow wing are simply DIFFERENT.

As for comfort, the difference between my long body Mooney and an A-36 for the pilot and co-pilot are negligible; mostly dependent upon personal preference of seating position. There is exactly on inch difference in cabin shoulder width between the two aircraft. I have measured the two side by side.

Now, with that out of the way, you are about to make a very costly mistake. Getting out of your Mooney at this time and into an A-36 is going to be a very expensive transition. THE MARKET SUCKS. Owning a GX, you have a very nice and capable airplane and to equal it in an A-36 is going to knock one big hole in your wallet.

With less than what you are going to lose wholesaling the Mooney, go buy a Cessna 182Q Skylane and let your partner get some time and experience. You can buy a nice one for $100,000, fly it for two years and even if you lose $30,000 selling it, it's nickels and dimes compared to what you are proposing. On a 200 nm flight the difference will be about twenty minutes max. The insurance and maintenance on the Skylane will be minimal and the safety margins for a low time pilot significant. In fact, your Ovation is just about as much faster than the A-36 than the A-36 is faster than the Skylane.

In the mean time, put your GX up for sale, be reasonable, and you will sell it for an acceptable amount of depreciation. Fly the Skylane while you are looking for the A-36 and buy your wife a new Mercedes on what you are going to save by not doing what you are proposing.

Please forgive any appearance of "i know it all", I do not.

Not Sky King,
Jgreen

All that being said, if you are determined to do it, CALL NEIL.

jgreen

Tell Neal that 50% of the commission should go back to the General Fund at BeechTalk.

Good points, John. Here's some background and my reasoning for this swap. My company is a consulting engineering firm, we do work mostly in the southeast. Our clients are architects. We bought our first company plane from Parker Rhett in Diamondhead, MS (top notch guy). Three A36s and a B55 before Parker was lost in an accident. In 2008 we had two B58s when my flying partner left to start his own firm, leaving both Barons behind. I tried to sell the newer B58 for a while and was offered the 2005 Ovation GX in partial trade.

I reasoned that the Mooney would be more efficient for business travel when there is just one or two of us, which is more than half of the trips we take. So I accepted the trade knowing very little about Mooneys. I got checked out (marginally) and have put about 800 hours on it in the last four years. We still have the Baron and use it for trips with more than two people or longer trips or trips where the on-board radar is useful.

The first year with the Mooney was not all that happy. Landings were more worrisome than I like. I know all you guys grease every landing because all of your numbers are spot-on all the time but, for me, some landings were better than others. Some greased, some bounced and one memorable PIO that ended in a go-round with full flaps and spoilers deployed. In the Mooney, every landing has to be greased, no exceptions allowed.

What I know for a fact is that the Mooney requires better and more consistent landing technique than a Bonanza or Baron. And I also know that low time pilots are more prone to poor landing technique. So I'm more comfortable with my low time pilot/business partner building time in the Bonanza than in the Mooney. It goes without saying that he will be properly instructed and mentored and instrument rated before he takes employees or clients on a trip.

As to why an A36, it's really the passenger accommodations. Many times, the people that I carry in the plane are first timers in "little" airplanes. For those people, for heavy people and for old people those Baron/Bonanza double doors and that club seating is a huge relief. The speed and efficiency of the Mooney is a plus but doesn't change the business case for a trip by a significant amount (check the spreadsheet that I posted a while back and see).

I like the Mooney because it's fast and efficient and I always get to sit in the front seat. I don't like to put adults in the back seat of the Mooney, although they tell me the legroom is not too bad. The ride of the Mooney in turbulence is bone-jarring, probably the properties of the wing that make it fast also put a sharp edge on every wind gust.

I like the Mooney because it will carry a load, and that's all I'm going to say about that. I don't like that it is so dainty. The wing skins seem less "robust" than the Beech line. When I first got it, the NACA vent inlet on the pilot side vibrated in the wind enough to tear the skin for about 2" aft of the vent. Had to go back to Kerrville to fix that properly. Shortly after that, a small bird, the size of a sparrow maybe, creased the top wing skin on an impact that I never even heard. There it was, though, guts, feathers and a crease in the sheet metal. So back to Kerrville for that repair.

A fixed-gear Cessna is not an option because I'm going to have to fly the single when the Baron is down or when it's just me or when I'm buying the gas and I just don't want to fly a Cessna.

And the Cirrus is out of the question because friends don't let friends fly plastic airplanes.

Gene,

I might have missed it. What is the mission? All you stated was one to two people for business. What distance? Reasons I ask, trading in the Mooney like John said is going to be painful. Depending on what you are looking to do in terms of ditance and time an older V-Tail might be a good choice, or one of the many others I demo planes I flew before I ended up in an Aerostar.

Tim

There isnt going to be a G1000 installed in a V-tail like in the Ovation 2GX

Tim - the mission varies from one person to as many as six. Most trips are less than 500 miles.

Byron - the truth about the G1000 is (for me) it offers no advantage over steam gauges with at least one 430 or 530. Pretty to look at but that's all.

Gene

Also impossible or very expensive to upgrade the G1000 to WAAS.

Gene,

With the assumption that for 4+ people you will normally be taking the Baron. Based on when I was looking to upgrade last year (I was all over the map) here are the ones I would consider.

Newish planes:
Tecnam P2006T. -- Really cheap to operate, but probably to slow.
Cirrus SR22 -- You can pickup reasonable cheap FIKI SR22s now.
Diamond DA42NG -- Expensive aquisition, but direct operating cost is cheap now. Plus fun to fly -- really docile. Likes very looooong runways.
Beech G36 -- It does it all. Need I say more?
Piper Mirage or Matrix -- Very nice to fly, I was afraid of the engine issues if you run balls to the wall which I like to do.

Older planes:
A36 -- There is a premium on it because it is popular. But has enough slop in the gear to make everything appear like a greased landing. Reasonable direct operating costs. Lots of really good upgrade options available.
PropJet -- Expensive, did not actually fly it. But was comfortable to sit in; and would get you there quickly.

Good luck,


Tim

Mooney gets 80 grand to swap the boxes and upgrade to WAAS. Its 20-30K on Beech and Cesssna. Garmin licensed the STC to the airplane manufacturer, so they are free to bend you over.