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11 May 2025, 00:33 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 10:55 
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Joined: 01/24/10
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Location: Concord , CA (KCCR)
Aircraft: 1967 Baron B55
P210 with the TIO550 conversation. The 550 conversion made the P210 into a very nice airplane.


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 10:58 
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Joined: 08/30/13
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Company: Cruce Aircraft Services
Location: KPGD
Aircraft: Learjet 55, C-310
Aerostar is the best supported, easiest to get parts for, fastest.If you can pull the power back in the teens you can do 200kts on 28GPH


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 11:04 
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Joined: 12/16/07
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Company: Real Estate development
Location: Addison -North Dallas(ADS), Texas
Aircraft: In between
Jim: We went from the TN A-36 with tips to the P-Baron and were very pleased. In the TN, the need for oxygen wasn't popular with family and friends. On long trips, it was easy to get into nasty weather or have to overfly areas with low ceilings and ice or ice potential. The P-Baron gave many more options. It's basically your plane with a bit narrower cabin to accommodate the pressure vessel. The the engines are very similar to what you have except TC instead of TN. I ran them LOP in cruise and descent. I normally filed in the low flight levels. Nice nose compartment if not full of other stuff.
Hope you find something you like.
Unlike what as been said above, it was not a hangar queen. We had very little down time due to maintenance. I believe we had waste gate issues once, and normal stuff for two engines. AC had to becharged once or twice, but it sure was nice. If one buys a good bird and has someone good working on it, it does pretty well. Of course, we hear all the stories from those that didn't follow the above. One thing that helped is if the engines were running well, we directed maintenance not to touch them on annuals. If they do the normal spark plug and other stuff, I'll guarantee it won't run like it did before going in. We timed our engines with a digital protractor, and it improved performance noticeably.

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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 11:19 
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Joined: 11/08/12
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Location: Jackson, MS (KHKS)
Aircraft: 1961 Cessna 172
I am reminded of that classic piece of cinema “The Money Pit”

A pressurized piston twin is not the path to certain bankruptcy (like say an old gulfstream) but it does cost more

It’s like a 6000 square foot house on 2 acres with a pool. It does cost more to keep up than a 4br tract house with a yard your 12yo can cut with a push mower.


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 11:24 
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Joined: 07/13/09
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Username Protected wrote:
I am reminded of that classic piece of cinema “The Money Pit”

A pressurized piston twin is not the path to certain bankruptcy (like say an old gulfstream) but it does cost more

It’s like a 6000 square foot house on 2 acres with a pool. It does cost more to keep up than a 4br tract house with a yard your 12yo can cut with a push mower.





I've only had 2 Aerostars, 2 P-Barons....a Navajo, a 414, a 340....


and Charles...I'd say you have insight.


and, I wish I could be back in a Pressurized plane. (recently mine was in the shop, I rented a P-Baron to make one of my routine trips. The fuel bill was higher, but the comfort was greater)

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"Most of my money I spent on airplanes. The rest I just wasted....."
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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 11:45 
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Joined: 03/28/09
Posts: 145
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Location: Carson City, NV
Aircraft: 1981 P210N
The P210N with a 520 is a slow climber due to temperature constraints (keeping CHTs at or below 380). Count on 600 fpm after pulling back from take-off power. In cruise I see 175 TAS at 18 gph. I cruise from 15-19k depending on winds.

Mine is FIKI (caveat Flint tips which are not certified), A/C, and mid-level panel. Useful load is only 1350 lbs. I have room for 122 gallons which gives me just over 600 lbs useful with full fuel and a range just under 1000 nm with IFR reserves (no wind).

One common complaint I hear is that it flies like a truck. It does. That makes it a very stable instrument platform. I personally like that as I didn't buy it to do barrel rolls.

Maintenance costs will vary. I am seeing that cylinder life is pretty crumby even with great attention paid to temperatures, so I am sure there is no way to expect the cylinders to make the TBO of the bottom end. Probably will require top work every 500 hrs or so.

I would say it offers a pretty good combination of cost and value, though there are warts. Having the acquisition cost $150K less than a similarly equipped Malibu was a consideration. That $150k buys a lot of fuel and the maintenance is probably similar.

To each his own. Good luck. Pressurization is a game changer.

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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:03 
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Joined: 10/16/13
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Company: Advantage Technologies
Location: Franklin, TN
Aircraft: Citation 510 Mustang
You will be hard pressed to beat a Malibu. Unless you can swing the cap cost of a Meridian, the Malibu is the one to beat. Piper is still making them - parts are readily available - fleet is well supported - excellent maintenance options - easy to fly - fast and economical - solid owners group with great OEM relationship - lots of flexibility.

Hard to beat them..


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:29 
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Username Protected wrote:
Mirage question - at overhaul time can a Mirage be converted to a Continental TSIO-550 via the M5 STC?


No. IMHO, nor would you want to. The Lyc is a great reliable engine and has 40 more HP.

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Chuck Ivester
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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:35 
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Username Protected wrote:
P-337 maybe?



Not FIKI, at least not from the factory. Don't know if there's an aftermarket FIKI for any P337, but I don't think there is.

Value is a big word though. That depends on how you use it. If you want to buy one and never fly it, then purchase price is the bottom line. If you want to cover dozens of 500-1000 mile trips a month in all kinds of weather with as little downtime as possible so you can make money, then value is a different equation.

There are no cheap airplanes. Lots of expensive ones though.

You can make a short list of pressurized piston singles, a somewhat longer list of pressurized piston twins, then we get into the single engine turboprops, the twin turboprops, then single engine jets and multiengine jets.


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:40 
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Username Protected wrote:
Mirage question - at overhaul time can a Mirage be converted to a Continental TSIO-550 via the M5 STC?


No. IMHO, nor would you want to. The Lyc is a great reliable engine and has 40 more HP.


550 is capable of 350

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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:42 
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Aircraft: Aerostar Superstar 2
Technically most of Aerostars aren't FIKI either - it's an upgrade with inner boots. Some of the last models like the 700P etc I think did come from factory that way, but the majority you'll have to upgrade.

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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:51 
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PA46 is your best bet in that budget range. I had the same question and my partner and I spent a lot of time hemming and hawing...it's super comfortable, fast, efficient, and pretty lux!


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:55 
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Aircraft: C177RG, ATOS-VR
The A*, 340, 421C all have tail that are taller than most standard hangars (over 12').

Vince


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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 12:59 
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Username Protected wrote:
550 is capable of 350


Not in a Malibu ;-) I guess you could do it with an STC with unlimited resources with no hope of getting your investment back though ;-) A TIO 540-AE2A putting out 350 HP is a normal day at the office (the engine has no time limitation at 350 HP). 350 from a Conti 550 is on the verge of grenading... ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: What’s the best VALUE in a FIKI, pressurized aircraft?
PostPosted: 16 Apr 2019, 18:47 
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Joined: 11/25/16
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Location: KSBD
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Username Protected wrote:
...A TIO 540-AE2A putting out 350 HP is a normal day at the office (the engine has no time limitation at 350 HP)...


It better run well for that $$$. Ouch.


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