did not really see your negatives


Norm may need to chime in here, but I think it's a good thing. We have another PC12 center coming online here shortly.......they'll be a great one.



The PC24 is a good airplane, but it is NOT what the PC12 is.........which is frigging phenomenal...............I worry that if they make the PC12 a 300knt airplane it will take most sales away from the 24.



Stick you on the board, and BOOM, you take all credit!!!!



I found it dirt simple, other than some ID10T errors with myself.



that's the damn truth........no way I'm paying 75k for sv when my ipad and a 300 subscription with Foreflight is way, way, way........and can I say much more better?



AGREED



just got done with my second annual........have not done a 150hrs inspection......flown near 1000 hrs. My annual was 5 days.........but I prepped everyone with what I needed

If you review flightaware there are more PC12's flying than any other GA airplane.......now those may all be used in commercial ops but I don't think so........I was at KFXE today and had 5 PC12's take off in the space of 30 minutes............

it's economics.............still in production, good operating costs for high utilization, ease of operation/training.......and they carry a ton and go a long way.................

I doubt that I will sell the 12.......may get a jet, but it will most probably be an Eclipse!!!!

In 1300 hours of ownership....... I've never done a 150 hour inspection.

I prefer the trackball to touch screen. I can touch any part of any screen in turbulence.

No doubt the next iteration of PC12 will have improved Honeywell (probably with touch screen ) and 300+ knots.

How will they get the 300kts? Different wing maybe?

We have an older “Legacy” PC12/45 that we purchased just over a year ago. My two cents..

Negatives:
• Honeywell’s lack of support and pricing. We are undergoing a dual g600 upgrade right now as the Honeywell stuff was extremely unreliable (granted it is older but we have never had an airplane with as many avionics failures as we have experienced with Honeywell stuff). I would love to see Garmin provide a new engine information system as well.

• The flap system is very complex (not sure if this is a negative as it is designed to prevent any split flap situations). However, it can be “finicky” and is frustrating having to do hard resets on the ground.

• It is a rougher ride than some other airplanes in its class. It has been noticed by some family members that were used to other airplanes. It isn’t by any means bad, but compared to some other airplanes it isn’t as smooth through the bumps.


Pros:
• It is a simple airplane to fly, no doubt about it. CG / payload provides a ton of flexibility. Additionally, like a King Air if you need a second pilot they are very easy to come by. The 45 is heavier in roll as it does not have the flettner tabs as are on the 47. However, I find hand flying the airplane very easy as it is pretty solid.

• Fuel system / management is simple. No managing between tanks.

• The range is really incredible. A typical trip for me is Allentown to Miami which with winter winds is usually a tight squeeze for a lot of airplanes (including our previous). However, that is no longer a concern with the pc12. At cruise (FL260/270) I burn 325pph (67B engine). With the pc12 holding 2700 lbs of fuel, it will go a ways! If the headwinds are really bad, it is still pretty efficient going down low..

• Support by our maintenance provider is the best we have ever seen. If I am tied up with work, they will send their pilots up to retrieve the airplane and fly it back. They have gone above and beyond for us.

• We have the 5 blade MT prop and it is very quiet and smooth.. Unfortunately it can be a little too quiet as passengers can always hear what we are talking about up front! I have heard the Hartzell is louder / more vibration BUT is a better performer..

• It isn’t the fastest by any stretch, but it isn’t too slow. With the 67B we flightplan 255-260 depending on temperature. I limit to 710 ITT and then torque up high (which is always below 710). PW says we can go to 760 ITT, while Pilatus recommends 720.

• The cabin is extremely comfortable. Additionally, the cargo door makes loading really easy (I didn’t care about the cargo door when looking at the airplane, but I got to love it really quick!!!).

There's 10 on controller right now and have been for the last several weeks, including this one that I like because it has G600s, good times, and is coming off 135. Am I missing something? Why aren't these selling? Is it the asking price?

https://www.controller.com/listings/air ... s-pc-12-47

What would the MX cost be like for a low utilization operator (~100 hours per year). I know most PC-12's are flown more than this but what would one expect to pay annually for garden variety MX not including HSI's prop overhauls, 10 yr wing demate, etc?

How will they get the 300kts? Different wing maybe?

When I consider how massive the -67 is, to me that seems extreme... but there are a lot bigger turboshaft engines out there, so why not!

I wonder if they won't reach the point of diminishing returns, I think we are seeing that on the -67 powered King Air... 320 - 330 knots (avg 25 knots faster) even though that's a lot more horsepower and a lot more fuel!

The problem is the King Air is about as aerodynamic as a golf ball with extroverted dimples.

The flap system is complex and EXPENSIVE. Actuators cost $11k each (4) and the PDU is another $25k

I'll take a stab but it's probably not what you are looking for. Too many ways you can slice the numbers. I think of airplanes in terms of total annual expense. Ours runs about $350K/year for about 350hrs/year; so $1000/hr; includes engine reserves. So I don't see how a lower utilization operator could get by with any less than 100K/year, unless he just didn't fly it.

Brent, we replaced the flap control and warning unit in August. Not cheap but that has alleviated the problem almost 100%. Unfortunately I still have an occasional failure when connected to a GPU.. After back and forth with the shop we have started using a different GPU and it hasn't happened (there may have been a spike or something on start with the previous one).

How will they get the 300kts? Different wing maybe?

Interesting. I just finished my recurrent training at flight safety and they mentioned that the flaps don't like voltages changes while in operation so they recommended not operating the gear while the flaps are in transit or operating flaps until the generators have come online and producing 28v after startup.

Thanks Brent. I think like you do as well in terms of total annual expense but it's easier to figure out things like insurance and hangar which vary a lot depending on location/type of operation. With my C425 I think my annual MX spend (100 hrs per year) is around $30K not including expensive one time events like HSI, etc. I am able to do some of the small routine MX myself with a local A&P and I only take it to the big name shop for inspections and stuff I can't/don't want to tackle. I'm just trying to gauge whether the PC-12 would be more than that. It sounds like it would.

As a note to folks looking at controller.....most of those listings are bogus.........when I was looking for my bird, half of them did not even call back. Those with brokers called back saying that the bird was sold but they could find me another one...............

I think that the most telling stat is the number flying on Flightaware......simply staggering..........

I was at the airport yesterday and for 30 minutes, every third plane leaving was a PC12.........saw a Kodiak take off too.........I like those damn airplanes........one of the guys had to grab his hat and jumped in just as it was lifting off, man it takes off quickly!!!

I'm still using the joystick. Actually to be fair, I hated the Apex system at first but now I love it. In many ways it's faster and more intuitive than Garmin. It's a good system... should be touch screen though! and needs XM radio... no tunes. and less expensive, 70k for SVT is just stupid.