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 Post subject: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fleet.
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 00:39 
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Joined: 05/29/13
Posts: 14544
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Company: Easy Ice, LLC
Location: Marquette, Michigan; Scottsdale, AZ, Telluride
Aircraft: C510,C185,C310,R66
Will allow me to go non stop between PHX and Marquette offices. Jet Fuel at SDL if hangered is $2.40/gal/ Burns 100/hr. 365kts....1500 mile range. Vs. in the 310...8 hours with a stop. 200 gal at 5 a gal = $1,000 vs 4 hours at 100 - 400 at 2.4 - $960 and four hours.

cap ex not an issue. Opex higher but at 41k in 26 minutes the load is a lot lighter. Might even loan Luc the 310.

Talk me in or out!

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Mark Hangen
Deputy Minister of Ice (aka FlyingIceperson)
Power of the Turbine
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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 00:43 
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Joined: 03/30/11
Posts: 4278
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Location: Greenwood, MO
Definitely do it! (Luc, PM me for my address. I like Scotch.) :duck:


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 00:44 
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Joined: 07/30/12
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Company: Aerlogix, Jet Aeronautical
Location: Prescott, AZ
Aircraft: B-55, RV-6
Great plane with the Williams motors! Great plane without them too, the extra range of the Eagle is great! Go for it.


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 00:46 
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Joined: 11/08/12
Posts: 7649
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Location: Live in San Carlos, CA - based Hayward, CA KHWD
Aircraft: Piaggio Avanti
Username Protected wrote:
Jet Fuel at SDL if hangered is $2.40/gal/ Burns 100/hr. 365kts....

I personally would not make a long term decision based on the short term price of JetA. My sneaking suspicion is that prices will head back up after fairly short term. A year, maybe two, but not five or ten. JMHO.

That said, if you need reliable functional travel then a turbine will be more reliable in many ways, plus the time savings. It is probably worth the extra expense.

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-Jon C.


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 01:57 
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Joined: 12/03/14
Posts: 20729
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Company: Ciholas, Inc
Location: KEHR
Aircraft: C560V
Username Protected wrote:
I personally would not make a long term decision based on the short term price of JetA.

While I agree generally, I note that the cost spread between Jet-A and 100LL continues to increase. This makes the extra fuel burn of the jet more and more affordable as time goes by. If jet fuel jumps up to $5, then 100LL is $10 or higher. So the relative cost remains the same, or even improves for Jet-A over time as less and less 100L is being used.

The other factor is that the 310 is not really 8 hours. Add some weather, add some headwinds, and it can take bloody all day to get somewhere. The jet will be more reliable, though 1400nm in headwinds might require a stop some days.

Mike C.

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Email mikec (at) ciholas.com


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 02:09 
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Joined: 11/08/12
Posts: 7649
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Location: Live in San Carlos, CA - based Hayward, CA KHWD
Aircraft: Piaggio Avanti
Username Protected wrote:
The jet will be more reliable, ...

And that is the best reason...

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-Jon C.


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 06:58 
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Joined: 06/08/12
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Company: Mayo Clinic
Location: Rochester, MN
Aircraft: Planeless in RST
So, Mark, after throwing TWO alternator belts on an appraoch in IMC, over Lake Huron, how do you feel about this now???.

But, I'm staying out of this.....
Working on my MEL.....
:coffee:

:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 07:48 
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Joined: 12/22/07
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Company: Midwest Chemtrails, LLC
Location: KPTK (SE Michigan)
Aircraft: C205
Luc,

Expect a call from Tom Gresham!

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Holoholo …


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2015, 13:17 
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Joined: 01/31/09
Posts: 5193
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Location: Northern NJ
Aircraft: SR22;CJ2+;C510
The Willams engines on Tap? It will cost you about $240/hour for the engine program.

Shop CJ2s also. You may find a CJ2 with a much newer airframe and avionics is not that much more and will hold value much better.

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Allen


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 14 Jan 2015, 01:03 
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Joined: 07/11/11
Posts: 2405
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Location: Woodlands TX
Aircraft: C525 D1K Waco PT17
Username Protected wrote:
Will allow me to go non stop between PHX and Marquette offices. Jet Fuel at SDL if hangered is $2.40/gal/ Burns 100/hr. 365kts....1500 mile range. Vs. in the 310...8 hours with a stop. 200 gal at 5 a gal = $1,000 vs 4 hours at 100 - 400 at 2.4 - $960 and four hours.

cap ex not an issue. Opex higher but at 41k in 26 minutes the load is a lot lighter. Might even loan Luc the 310.

Talk me in or out!


Add to that 4000 fpm climb rate, 2000 fpm single engine, easy to fly and on top of most weather. It is a great option Mark. Do it!


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 14 Jan 2015, 02:39 
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Joined: 12/29/10
Posts: 1569
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Location: Houston, TX USA
Aircraft: Learjet
Do it!

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Destroyer of the world’s finest aircraft since 1985.


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 14 Jan 2015, 10:18 
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Joined: 02/11/14
Posts: 582
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Location: KCOE/KSFF
Nothing in class compares to the FJ44-2A Eagle II Mark. Go for it, you won't regret it :stir:


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 14 Jan 2015, 10:21 
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Joined: 05/13/14
Posts: 9116
Post Likes: +7642
Location: Central Texas (KTPL)
Aircraft: PA-46-310P
Username Protected wrote:
Jet Fuel at SDL if hangered is $2.40/gal/ Burns 100/hr. 365kts....

I personally would not make a long term decision based on the short term price of JetA.


Don't mess up his "spouse" math. "I don't really want to switch to a jet, but I'm trying to save some money here."

GET THE JET! :cheers:

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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 14 Jan 2015, 10:25 
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Joined: 01/29/08
Posts: 26338
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Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
I say "do it". Once you're on JetA you'll never look back. I think it's more than 100GPH though.


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 Post subject: Re: Seriously adding a Citation Eagle Williams Mod to the fl
PostPosted: 14 Jan 2015, 10:33 
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Joined: 09/02/09
Posts: 8726
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Company: OAA
Location: Oklahoma City - PWA/Calistoga KSTS
Aircraft: UMF3, UBF 2, P180 II
Mark,

I think its a very appealing airplane. I've been reading Sierra's information for a while and for the money and capability, in a jet, I don't know if you can do better. Fast, far and while not free not to expensive compared to the options.

You might be able to do this trip in a Conquest for less operating expense and maybe a Pilatus for more capital cost.

Do you want to commit to the training required? That's a big question I think. If you don't there are a boat load of pilots with the type rating. Put the plane on a management agreement and always have someone who can back you up or fly you.


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