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22 Nov 2025, 05:49 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 25 Oct 2016, 13:36 
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Aircraft: 700P, F35, D17
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Did they find a cause Eric?


The turbo went back to the shop that built it and I will let you know what they say. I will bet that it will be a long list of why it could not possibly be their problem but maybe I will get lucky and they will stand behind it. I will make sure to give them the appropriate thumbs down or up when I get through this issue.


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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 25 Oct 2016, 13:40 
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A known turbo failure at altitude should not be considered as an inconvenience of flying without boost, especially in a twin. It should be thought of as a potential exhaust failure blow torching the other side of the firewall and trying to burn your airplane.

I have a temperature probe between the turbo and the firewall that in the event of lost boost will tell me whether I should shut down even if I don't have a suitable airport at which to land.

Don't take a failed turbo lightly. It is a sign to land at the first suitable airport, if not sooner.



The good news for me was that at FL210 that engine turned cold quick and my airplane does have a fire light which is activated by a probe on the firewall. No light.


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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 26 Oct 2016, 02:55 
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I have a temperature probe between the turbo and the firewall that in the event of lost boost will tell me whether I should shut down even if I don't have a suitable airport at which to land.


This sounds interesting. Where is it located and how is it displayed?


I just used an extra wire from the engine monitor, twisted the pair and ran it above the turbo. it is light enough to just sit there, secured from the bundle that runs along the fuselage. If I remember i will take a picture.

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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 26 Oct 2016, 09:00 
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Company: Hausch LLC, rep. Power/mation
Location: Milwaukee, WI (KMKE)
Aircraft: 1963 Debonair B33
Username Protected wrote:
This sounds interesting. Where is it located and how is it displayed?


I just used an extra wire from the engine monitor, twisted the pair and ran it above the turbo. it is light enough to just sit there, secured from the bundle that runs along the fuselage. If I remember i will take a picture.


Interesting and creative. I don't know enough about exhaust system failure modes in turbo charged aircraft, but it sounds like that would catch at least one of those failure modes.

From what I know about thermocouples, though, you might want to get a good gas-tight crimp on that pair to prevent corrosion (and incorrect readings) at the junction.

Again, sounds very interesting and creative.
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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 26 Oct 2016, 21:14 
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Eric,

When you got lower to say 10k did the engine work fine? I thought these turbo engines were supposed to work fine and just become normally aspirated when turbos failed?

Remy


Yes, below 10,000 the engine was fine and ran ok but above 14K there was very little power. I opted to stay at 17,500 since that was a reasonable altitude for my flight plan and I was in constant contact with ATC. They were ok with me at 17,500 and altitude was my friend as far as I was concerned. ATC seemed comfortable with the plan as was I because the plane was completely under control. Although I could have diverted to a closer airport there was really no reason to do so because at about 14,000 feet the right engine came back to life.


I'm confused. When did you feather it, and when was it running?

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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 27 Oct 2016, 04:42 
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Here is a picture of the twisted pair. Nothing very critical here or no great need to be accurate. In cruise it indicates between 160 and 190 degrees depending on temperature and altitude. It shows up as oil temperature on the JPI. If I had a loss of boost and saw the same kind of temperature I would continue to the nearest suitable airport. If I saw 300 or 400 I would be grabbing for the mixture.

Picture looks like the wire is touching the turbo but it I sent not.

Ok picture is upside down.


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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 27 Oct 2016, 07:46 
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Very interesting, Marc. All kinds of questions in my head, but I don't want you to get the idea that I don't like the concept. I do.

I just know very little about the layout of TC plumbing.

Is that a likely failure point/leak area? Could a leak elsewhere go undetected but still cause fire issues? We can move this to PMs if you'd like.

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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 29 Oct 2016, 02:19 
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Very interesting, Marc. All kinds of questions in my head, but I don't want you to get the idea that I don't like the concept. I do.

I just know very little about the layout of TC plumbing.

Is that a likely failure point/leak area? Could a leak elsewhere go undetected but still cause fire issues? We can move this to PMs if you'd like.


My thinking is that if there is a breach in the exhaust anywhere near the turbo and I am getting a blow torch thing happening, the temperature everywhere around the turbo and even around the back of the engine compartment will become seriously elevated. My probe has never reached 200 degrees where it is and usually runs around 160 to 170. I believe that if I get a loss of boost this thing will tell me if there is an eminent risk of fire. It don't think it matters how accurate it is or how ideal is the placement of the probe.

Actually, I didn't stay up all night thinking about this. When I was installing the system I had an extra set of wires. Rather than just tie them off I ran them close to the turbo. I like being able to see the temperature there even when everything is working well.


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 Post subject: Re: Uncontained Turbocharger Failure
PostPosted: 29 Oct 2016, 09:00 
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Good idea in general Marc,

I saw a 414 that had a stack fail, it torched the aluminum behind the turbo area....up to the cap on the nacelle aux tank. :bugeye: I'm sure your system would have alerted the pilot to the exhaust leak. I don't know if there was a loss of boost.
I wish I could have talked to the pilot, but I only saw the result.

Jeff

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soloed in a land of Superhomers/1959 Cessna 150, retired with Proline 21/ CJ4.


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