BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 17:26

Look on Cabela's website. They have a toilet seat made to fit on a five gallon bucket. :pilot:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 17:35

I have a neighbor who gave up his very nice 421C for a TBM 700B. He was told he could operate it for the same cost as the 421C.
Total cost all in for the 421C was 60,000 per year for 100 hours.
First annual on the TBM for 90 hours was 70,000 dollars.
Just the annual on the TBM was more than his whole annual operating budget for the 421.
The 421C had a potty and relief tube, the TBM does not.
The 421 will carry 1200 pounds of payload for 800 NM. The TBM will not carry 1200 pounds 800 NM.
The cost difference to move up was one million dollars.
He does go faster, farther with 2 people now?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 17:45

Username Protected wrote:

Look on Cabela's website. They have a toilet seat made to fit on a five gallon bucket. :pilot:

Haha! I can just hear Robin Leach describing it now.

"This 4 million dollar executive transport is luxury for the working man... the flying chariot features enough range to get from Beverly Hills to Aspen, has all of the latest computer gadgets for navigation, seats six in rich leather, and oh, what's this? it even has a paintbucket you can %#$@ in. It truly is shangri-la for the nouveau riche on the go..."

:doh:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 17:57

Username Protected wrote:

I have a neighbor who gave up his very nice 421C for a TBM 700B. He was told he could operate it for the same cost as the 421C.
Total cost all in for the 421C was 60,000 per year for 100 hours.
First annual on the TBM for 90 hours was 70,000 dollars.

What level inspection did the plane undergo as part of the purchase process ?

There are probably just as many examples of people who sunk 70k on catch-up maintenance into a 421 during the first year of ownership.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:05

Username Protected wrote:

I have a neighbor who gave up his very nice 421C for a TBM 700B. He was told he could operate it for the same cost as the 421C.
Total cost all in for the 421C was 60,000 per year for 100 hours.
First annual on the TBM for 90 hours was 70,000 dollars.

What level inspection did the plane undergo as part of the purchase process ?

There are probably just as many examples of people who sunk 70k on catch-up maintenance into a 421 during the first year of ownership.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:25

Username Protected wrote:

Look on Cabela's website. They have a toilet seat made to fit on a five gallon bucket. :pilot:

Haha! I can just hear Robin Leach describing it now.

"This 4 million dollar executive transport is luxury for the working man... the flying chariot features enough range to get from Beverly Hills to Aspen, has all of the latest computer gadgets for navigation, seats six in rich leather, and oh, what's this? it even has a paintbucket you can %#$@ in. It truly is shangri-la for the nouveau riche on the go..."

:doh:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 18:29

Username Protected wrote:

All the TBM owners I know tell me annuals run from 30,000 to 70,000 and the average is 40,000.

Ouch. I felt my wallet cringe when I read that.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 22:42

Just go read all the treads about used jets, type rating and all and you will understand.
I fly 150-200 hrs a year and dont want to be bothered with any of this.
A Mustang will cost you 2-3 times the cost to fly than a TBM in Canada.
Im based on my private field 3400' ft and use a lot of 3-4000 ft fields in Canada and the Bahamas. Dont try this in a Jet at full gross with any safety margin.
As far as I know a new Mustang or M2 will cost you more than a new TBM?

Username Protected wrote:

This equipment is beyond my pay grade, but I'm nonetheless curious about something: Why would someone pay a 25-30% premium for a new TBM over a Mustang that has similar performance and seating, but also a potty and a second turbine? I get that the operating costs for the turboprop are reduced, but I believe I could buy a lot of Jet-A for the difference. Don't tell me short/soft field performance - I don't buy that owners are landing their nearly-$4m planes on grass. Curious to hear thoughts on a topic I've wondered about for years now.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 22:46

He must be going at a certain CA TBM shop...
Same as saying to take your Baron at a Beechcraft Service centre.

Username Protected wrote:

I have a neighbor who gave up his very nice 421C for a TBM 700B. He was told he could operate it for the same cost as the 421C.
Total cost all in for the 421C was 60,000 per year for 100 hours.
First annual on the TBM for 90 hours was 70,000 dollars.
Just the annual on the TBM was more than his whole annual operating budget for the 421.
The 421C had a potty and relief tube, the TBM does not.
The 421 will carry 1200 pounds of payload for 800 NM. The TBM will not carry 1200 pounds 800 NM.
The cost difference to move up was one million dollars.
He does go faster, farther with 2 people now?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Mar 2016, 22:59

Username Protected wrote:

He must be going at a certain CA TBM shop...
Same as saying to take your Baron at a Beechcraft Service centre.

Marc, what are the yearly Mx expenses running on your 700C2?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Mar 2016, 09:01

Check previous treads as I did post mx cost before.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Mar 2016, 15:10

Username Protected wrote:

Being immune from the requirement to follow the manufacturers maintenance schedule for US based planes is also a huge plus.

Can you expand on that, please? How can the "manufacturers maintenance schedule" be ignored for one but not the other? And why would you want to ignore it for a $4m investment that hurtles your kids through the sky at nearly 400 mph and 6 miles above the ground?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Mar 2016, 15:18

Username Protected wrote:

Can you expand on that, please? How can the "manufacturers maintenance schedule" be ignored for one but not the other?

14 CFR 91.409(f) requires that multiengine turbines be on a maintenance program, the practical default of which is 91.409(f)(4) which is the manufacturer's maintenance program. Oddly, single engine turbines do not fall under that requirement, which means you can just to an annual similar in scope to a piston airplane.

Quote:

And why would you want to ignore it for a $4m investment that hurtles your kids through the sky at nearly 400 mph and 6 miles above the ground?

Well, the manufacturer's maintenance program may be designed more to increase their cash flow or reduce their liability than to address needed maintenance, and if you are over a barrel by being required to use it then you get to pay whatever they think you should. Having the flexibility to do something different changes the equation.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Mar 2016, 15:33

Username Protected wrote:

I'm still trying to figure out how to use any "range extender" in a Bonanza without turning the plane into a biohazard cleanup project?

Perhaps I have low manifold pressure or my OEM main return line is to short but my hands are equal or greater then any presidential candidate running for office.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Mar 2016, 15:38

The real CSOB range extender is a gallon zip loc bag with a diaper at the bottom. Works great and available at every gas station.

TBM 930!