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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 26 May 2023, 14:16 
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[/quote]
We can’t count on the FAA to get the SPE figured out can we?
The big value will come with the STEC 5000 or Garmin GFC approval. That’s where the utility and maintenance will improve.
Given my own very poor on-going experience with the dysfunctional clowns at Genesys I wouldn’t hold my breath on the 5000 either.[/quote]

I think there will be ZERO benefit to a Garmin or Genesys autopilot on these birds.


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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 26 May 2023, 22:15 
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Username Protected wrote:
I think there will be ZERO benefit to a Garmin or Genesys autopilot on these birds.


I think "Zero" benefit is a bit strong. I do like the SPZ500 and it flies the airplane very well, but it's still an old AP and will get harder to support.

I've flown behind a Genesys in a Citation and it's very nice. Still needs a little work but it is an improvement over the Sperry.

Robert


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 Post subject: Re: For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 07:55 
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Joined: 12/16/16
Posts: 28
Company: AVIATION INVESTMENTS, INC.
Location: KORF
Aircraft: B55/CL30/HS125/LR75/
So, is this plane for sale or not……YES/NO
capn767@gmail.com


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 Post subject: Re: For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 09:21 
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Username Protected wrote:
Still for sale, you couldn't recreate this bird for this price!


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 Post subject: Re: For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 09:58 
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So, is this plane for sale or not……YES/NO
capn767@gmail.com


It's for sale and sitting in my hangar, 863-899-1617


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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 13:52 
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If it were a 551 it would be long gone, or at a higher price for sure, probably both. It’s just tough to make the numbers work unless you’ve got a pilot spouse or just love this plane.

For the 500 versus 501, yes, you would be right since the 501 has no compromises over the 500 and is single pilot.

For the 550 versus 551, the issue is not as clear. The 551 has reduced weight which affects range or payload capability. The 550 requires the SPE for single pilot operation. So either choice has negatives.

The SPE is not difficult to get, you simply have to train single pilot and pass the checkride single pilot (which is what you have to do to fly the 501 or 551). It is one day more and a few $K more than the 61.58 for the sim schools, and basically no extra time and maybe a little more money for in airplane training.

The main stumbling block is the entrance requirements for the SPE, namely commercial or better, 1000 total, 500 turbine. If you don't have those numbers (or are close enough to them such that you can mentor to them), then it is an issue.

There are increasing rumors the FAA is going to overhaul the SPE system soon, likely creating an CE-500S single pilot type rating in the process. Whether that materially changes the access to the part 25 (2 pilot) Citations is TBD. Such a change would be a great thing for the value of these airplanes, assuming the FAA doesn't frack it up in some way.

It may be the case picking up a 550 cheaply now is a great deal since you got ahead of the value increase a CE-500S type rating might create.

Mike C.



How would one be smart enough to be able to afford this plane, but think having under 1k TT would be a wise idea?

Also sim training, I’d wager if the cost of going to FSI CAE or simcom scares you, you arnt in a financial position to afford to play in the Jet A world

Plus you going to do last minute V1 cuts at night or in IMC in the real plane? Or do single engine go arounds at mins at night in the real plane? If not you’re training, especially single pilot with low time, well there are much more fun ways to kill yourself with a million bucks lol


*If you can’t swing full initial sim training and recurrent sim training, and don’t have we’ll over the mins hours wise I’m not sure why you’d even be looking at a jet

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 Post subject: Re: For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 17:06 
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Hey, let's not stomp on this guys sale. It's a really nice Citation, and looks like a really reasonable price. If the regs evolve such that it could be operated SP, then the value (and number of people wanting to buy it) shoots up considerably.

GLWS! This is all you need to know:

Full Jetech Garmin Panel
8900 TTSN
Zero since hot sections
Nice Paint
Near new interior.
Factory aft bench, extremely spacious
Freon
365-370kts, 800-900pph, 1400nm
$885k

:drool:

_________________
Matt Beckner


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 Post subject: Re: FS: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 20:29 
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Maybe Tarver will sell you the aft baggage for $950! My current aft baggage is filled with kids dirty Disney clothes and some Disney crap. Granted, that gets cleaned out this weekend.

That is a gorgeous plane with an amazing panel and gorgeous interior and exterior!

Username Protected wrote:
Full Jetech Garmin Panel
8900 TTSN

Zero since hot sections
Nice Paint
Near new interior.
Factory aft bench, extremely spacious
Freon
Aft Baggage
$950 firm

The 550 is the new V which would be 1 million more.

Text Mike at 863-899-1617


I’ll take it for $950.00 firm.
I hope the moderators hold advertiser’s to their typed #

Murray


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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 01:06 
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Username Protected wrote:
For the 500 versus 501, yes, you would be right since the 501 has no compromises over the 500 and is single pilot.

For the 550 versus 551, the issue is not as clear. The 551 has reduced weight which affects range or payload capability. The 550 requires the SPE for single pilot operation. So either choice has negatives.

The SPE is not difficult to get, you simply have to train single pilot and pass the checkride single pilot (which is what you have to do to fly the 501 or 551). It is one day more and a few $K more than the 61.58 for the sim schools, and basically no extra time and maybe a little more money for in airplane training.

The main stumbling block is the entrance requirements for the SPE, namely commercial or better, 1000 total, 500 turbine. If you don't have those numbers (or are close enough to them such that you can mentor to them), then it is an issue.

There are increasing rumors the FAA is going to overhaul the SPE system soon, likely creating an CE-500S single pilot type rating in the process. Whether that materially changes the access to the part 25 (2 pilot) Citations is TBD. Such a change would be a great thing for the value of these airplanes, assuming the FAA doesn't frack it up in some way.

It may be the case picking up a 550 cheaply now is a great deal since you got ahead of the value increase a CE-500S type rating might create.

Mike C.



How would one be smart enough to be able to afford this plane, but think having under 1k TT would be a wise idea?

Also sim training, I’d wager if the cost of going to FSI CAE or simcom scares you, you arnt in a financial position to afford to play in the Jet A world

Plus you going to do last minute V1 cuts at night or in IMC in the real plane? Or do single engine go arounds at mins at night in the real plane? If not you’re training, especially single pilot with low time, well there are much more fun ways to kill yourself with a million bucks lol


*If you can’t swing full initial sim training and recurrent sim training, and don’t have we’ll over the mins hours wise I’m not sure why you’d even be looking at a jet


You missed the main point. It’s the 500 turbine that’s the stumbling block. I bought and started flying a Citation single pilot with barely 50 hours Turbine Time and 1400 total time. In the last 2 1/2 years I’ve flown it over 700 hours single pilot, in all weather conditions very comfortably. You don’t need 500 hours of turbine time to comfortably fly a citation single pilot. However, since it’s a requirement for the SPE, it’s unavoidable on non SP birds.

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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 01:45 
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You missed the main point. It’s the 500 turbine that’s the stumbling block. I bought and started flying a Citation single pilot with barely 50 hours Turbine Time and 1400 total time. In the last 2 1/2 years I’ve flown it over 700 hours single pilot, in all weather conditions very comfortably. You don’t need 500 hours of turbine time to comfortably fly a citation single pilot. However, since it’s a requirement for the SPE, it’s unavoidable on non SP birds.



500 of turbine isn’t much


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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 02:43 
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Username Protected wrote:
You missed the main point. It’s the 500 turbine that’s the stumbling block. I bought and started flying a Citation single pilot with barely 50 hours Turbine Time and 1400 total time. In the last 2 1/2 years I’ve flown it over 700 hours single pilot, in all weather conditions very comfortably. You don’t need 500 hours of turbine time to comfortably fly a citation single pilot. However, since it’s a requirement for the SPE, it’s unavoidable on non SP birds.



500 of turbine isn’t much


It is for someone that’s spent his time flying high-performance, piston singles.

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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 03:04 
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Username Protected wrote:

It is for someone that’s spent his time flying high-performance, piston singles.


Who would be in a world of hurt going “zero to hero” in a jet on the dark stormy night when things go sideways


In the real world 1,000hrs and 500 turbine maybe get you a job flying skydivers, flying pax in a jet with those qualifications would get you laughed at and resume

Image


But hey, if you got the $$

Safety of your family and friends < your ego


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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 03:53 
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Username Protected wrote:

It is for someone that’s spent his time flying high-performance, piston singles.


Who would be in a world of hurt going “zero to hero” in a jet on the dark stormy night when things go sideways


In the real world 1,000hrs and 500 turbine maybe get you a job flying skydivers, flying pax in a jet with those qualifications would get you laughed at and resume

Image


But hey, if you got the $$

Safety of your family and friends < your ego


Like I said earlier, I had about 50 hours turbine when I started flying the citation single pilot. Piece of cake. Ego has nothing to do with it. Quite the contrary. The safety of my friends and family is the very reason I fly a jet as opposed to single/twin pistons.
If you don’t feel comfortable flying a jet SP then for your safety and those around you, please get yourself an sic.
However, projecting your insecurities on others, the ego boost notwithstanding, will not make you a better pilot.
This is the definition of Personal Minimums. Every pilot should stick to their PERSONAL comfort level. Some of us may only be comfortable in something that cruises under 150 kts or day vfr while others are comfortable flying jets SP on raw data approaches at 0 dark 30 to 200 and 1/4.
Fly safe!!

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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 11:30 
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Username Protected wrote:

Like I said earlier, I had about 50 hours turbine when I started flying the citation single pilot. Piece of cake. Ego has nothing to do with it. Quite the contrary. The safety of my friends and family is the very reason I fly a jet as opposed to single/twin pistons.
If you don’t feel comfortable flying a jet SP then for your safety and those around you, please get yourself an sic.
However, projecting your insecurities on others, the ego boost notwithstanding, will not make you a better pilot.
This is the definition of Personal Minimums. Every pilot should stick to their PERSONAL comfort level. Some of us may only be comfortable in something that cruises under 150 kts or day vfr while others are comfortable flying jets SP on raw data approaches at 0 dark 30 to 200 and 1/4.
Fly safe!!


I’ve flown a good deal professionally single pilot and also fly a jet, my point is in aviation 1k tt and 500 turbine would MAYBE get you hired as a SIC, no one would hire you to fly their family 91 or 135 with those hours. Just something to keep in mind


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 Post subject: Re: Still For Sale: All Garmin Citation 550
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 13:15 
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Username Protected wrote:

Like I said earlier, I had about 50 hours turbine when I started flying the citation single pilot. Piece of cake. Ego has nothing to do with it. Quite the contrary. The safety of my friends and family is the very reason I fly a jet as opposed to single/twin pistons.
If you don’t feel comfortable flying a jet SP then for your safety and those around you, please get yourself an sic.
However, projecting your insecurities on others, the ego boost notwithstanding, will not make you a better pilot.
This is the definition of Personal Minimums. Every pilot should stick to their PERSONAL comfort level. Some of us may only be comfortable in something that cruises under 150 kts or day vfr while others are comfortable flying jets SP on raw data approaches at 0 dark 30 to 200 and 1/4.
Fly safe!!


I’ve flown a good deal professionally single pilot and also fly a jet, my point is in aviation 1k tt and 500 turbine would MAYBE get you hired as a SIC, no one would hire you to fly their family 91 or 135 with those hours. Just something to keep in mind


A 500 hour TT pilot is MUCH safer in a Citation than a 421. Also, I believe the learning curve plateaus after a few thousand hours so a 30,000 hour pilot has 3000 hours of experience 10 times not 10 times the knowledge and experience.

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