25 Apr 2024, 08:13 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 31 Oct 2021, 14:06 |
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Joined: 05/05/09 Posts: 4966 Post Likes: +4797
Aircraft: G44, C501, C55, R66
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Username Protected wrote: Michal where is this plane located. And any chance at getting a ride in one of these? Thanks It’s in Florida. With a signed purchase agreement and deposit, absolutely!
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 01 Nov 2021, 20:09 |
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Joined: 04/24/18 Posts: 727 Post Likes: +340 Location: NYC
Aircraft: ISP Eagle II SR22 g2
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Username Protected wrote: Plus about 10-12k for the airplane cost. . I think we are assuming he owns the plane. This is an insurance approved school. I don't see how you could spend 10-12K in your own airplane.[/quote] I figured 7 hours including the ride. 1200-1500 an hour all in. Plus flying the plane to and from the school.
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 01 Nov 2021, 20:51 |
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Joined: 08/05/16 Posts: 3110 Post Likes: +2226 Company: Tack Mobile Location: KBJC
Aircraft: C441
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I’m just a tire kicker but what is the attraction to a 501 vs a II? Costs seem in the same ballpark.
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 01 Nov 2021, 21:28 |
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Joined: 12/03/14 Posts: 19252 Post Likes: +23622 Company: Ciholas, Inc Location: KEHR
Aircraft: C560V
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Username Protected wrote: I’m just a tire kicker but what is the attraction to a 501 vs a II? Costs seem in the same ballpark. 501 is single pilot from the factory. 550, which is a II, is a two pilot airplane unless you get the Single Pilot Exemption. The SPE requires additional training and experience to attain. The SPE requirements that block some are: Have ATP or Commercial certificate. At least 1000 hours total time. 500 hours as PIC or SIC in turbine powered airplanes. There is a 551, which is a II but single pilot. It is limited in weight which affects its utility. Mike C.
_________________ Email mikec (at) ciholas.com
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 01 Nov 2021, 21:58 |
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Joined: 05/17/10 Posts: 4435 Post Likes: +1740 Location: canuck
Aircraft: x23mouse
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessna_Citation_II#DesignQuote: The Citation II (Model 550) stretches the Citation I fuselage by 1.14m (3ft 9in), increasing seating capacity to 10 and baggage capacity. Wingspan was increased, its larger fuel capacity and more powerful, 2,500 lbf (11 kN) Pratt & Whitney Canada JT15D-4 engines provided higher cruise speeds and longer range.[2]
_________________ nightwatch...
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 01 Nov 2021, 22:40 |
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Joined: 11/06/20 Posts: 1313 Post Likes: +1298 Location: Tulsa, OK - KRVS
Aircraft: C501SP
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Username Protected wrote: Very nice!
Any estimates on what it would take for a 2700 hr pilot with a couple hundred turboprop hours, ATP and CFI-I both training and cost-wise? I have been following/tempted by these SP planes and still can't make sense of the lower acquisition cost compared to an older Meridian. I get it that the ongoing cost would be substantially greater.
I have got to quit clicking on these ads!!
Thanks. John Hi John, I just went through this a few weeks ago so here is my data. You are in the same region as me so you can use the same trainer and DPE. I went with Charles McConnell with Fiesta Destination Services and was very happy with the whole package. Cost for 4 days of Charles' time (1.5 days ground school and 2.5 days flying) at my home airport with travel was $7,000. DPE (in West Memphis KAWM) was $3,000. Total flying time was 10 hours which included the round trip from KRVS to KAWM and the check ride itself. I am a nerd so I had the systems, limitations, memory items, etc pretty cold before Charles even arrived. Charles has a ton of experience so I still learned a lot from ground school, but it went pretty fast. The flying is purely to teach you the test, not to teach you how to fly actual missions (for example, aside from the to/from the check ride, we never went over 6,500'). To learn how to actually fly the plane you need a mentor. Prior to training I had been flying missions with my mentor (USAFA, 20-year Viper pilot, 5 years United, 15 years SWA, took a package during COVID and started flying Citations for a charter outfit). He charges $1,200/day for flying days and $850/day non-flying. Expensive, but I get along with him really well and I'm willing to pay for his depth of experience. I also really like his teaching style. Finally, I brought my plane from Tarver. Experience was straightforward and no surprises. Would do business with him again. If you have any questions, drop me a line.
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 02 Nov 2021, 18:01 |
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Joined: 07/14/14 Posts: 7623 Post Likes: +8976 Location: Georgia, VT (KFSO)
Aircraft: 1962 Debonair B33
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Username Protected wrote: +1 for Tarver, we bought a King Air from him back in the spring. Tarver wants to be bought from the same way he buys. "Heres the money, give me the keys and move out of my way. If the airplane doesn't sell itself to you, then I'm not going to go out of my way to."
Chris You make him sound like Arnie.
_________________ jh
Planes don’t care how much money you have. They only care how much money they need.
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 03 Nov 2021, 21:21 |
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Joined: 01/09/09 Posts: 3943 Post Likes: +796
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Username Protected wrote: +1 for Tarver, we bought a King Air from him back in the spring. Tarver wants to be bought from the same way he buys. "Heres the money, give me the keys and move out of my way. If the airplane doesn't sell itself to you, then I'm not going to go out of my way to."
Chris You make him sound like Arnie.
Except the “wants to be bought from” part
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 04 Nov 2021, 10:27 |
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Joined: 09/04/10 Posts: 3539 Post Likes: +3199
Aircraft: C55, PC-12
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Username Protected wrote: Very nice!
Any estimates on what it would take for a 2700 hr pilot with a couple hundred turboprop hours, ATP and CFI-I both training and cost-wise? I have been following/tempted by these SP planes and still can't make sense of the lower acquisition cost compared to an older Meridian. I get it that the ongoing cost would be substantially greater.
I have got to quit clicking on these ads!!
Thanks. John Hi John, I just went through this a few weeks ago so here is my data. You are in the same region as me so you can use the same trainer and DPE. I went with Charles McConnell with Fiesta Destination Services and was very happy with the whole package. Cost for 4 days of Charles' time (1.5 days ground school and 2.5 days flying) at my home airport with travel was $7,000. DPE (in West Memphis KAWM) was $3,000. Total flying time was 10 hours which included the round trip from KRVS to KAWM and the check ride itself. I am a nerd so I had the systems, limitations, memory items, etc pretty cold before Charles even arrived. Charles has a ton of experience so I still learned a lot from ground school, but it went pretty fast. The flying is purely to teach you the test, not to teach you how to fly actual missions (for example, aside from the to/from the check ride, we never went over 6,500'). To learn how to actually fly the plane you need a mentor. Prior to training I had been flying missions with my mentor (USAFA, 20-year Viper pilot, 5 years United, 15 years SWA, took a package during COVID and started flying Citations for a charter outfit). He charges $1,200/day for flying days and $850/day non-flying. Expensive, but I get along with him really well and I'm willing to pay for his depth of experience. I also really like his teaching style. Finally, I brought my plane from Tarver. Experience was straightforward and no surprises. Would do business with him again. If you have any questions, drop me a line.
So depending on how you estimate the cost of flight time, total cost was somewhere between 20 & 25K for an in-airplane type rating. I did mine at sim-com, 10 days and 12K (not including travel or hotel). This was an excellent deal, I think the list price is closer to 20K but MH got me in on this. Each method has different advantages, I think the best is to alternate (do your next recurrent in the sim) so you get exposed to both.
_________________ John Lockhart Phoenix, AZ Ridgway, CO
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Post subject: Re: FS: Citation 501SP Posted: 08 Nov 2021, 19:08 |
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Joined: 11/06/20 Posts: 1313 Post Likes: +1298 Location: Tulsa, OK - KRVS
Aircraft: C501SP
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Username Protected wrote: So depending on how you estimate the cost of flight time, total cost was somewhere between 20 & 25K for an in-airplane type rating. I did mine at sim-com, 10 days and 12K (not including travel or hotel). This was an excellent deal, I think the list price is closer to 20K but MH got me in on this. Each method has different advantages, I think the best is to alternate (do your next recurrent in the sim) so you get exposed to both. Hi John, Agreed. I do plan to do a sim recurrent as there are emergencies and scenarios that are too dangerous to practice in the real airplane. My push to do initial in-airplane was due to 2 related things. I wanted to actually learn how to fly my plane (vs a sim) and my plane has a full glass flight deck (2 x G600s and 2 x GTN750s). There are no 501 sims with that avionics setup. Plus I was moving from a G1000 Cirrus. So my fear was that I would spend a lot of time learning avionics that I would never use. Also, your sim initial was twice as long as my in-airplane. I'm in a phase of my life where time is more valuable than money. Everyone's situation is different. Sorry for the hijack Tarver, congrats on the sale! Is the buyer on BT?
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