23 Apr 2024, 10:47 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 25 Oct 2010, 15:57 |
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Joined: 12/12/07 Posts: 10873 Post Likes: +2233 Company: MBG Properties Location: Knoxville, TN (KDKX)
Aircraft: 1972 Bonanza V35B
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Hello, Mike. Welcome to BT. Buy a post '83 A36. It will handle your family until the boys start averaging over 150 pounds. As for slickness being a problem: This is only stated by persons who have never owned a Bonanza. Those with little or no experience flying a Bo should not be advising on which plane is best for you. I've flown all the brands and models with more than four seats and nothing comes close to the Bonanza in overall quality and utility. Good luck.
_________________ Max Grogan
Come fly with me.
My photos: https://photos.google.com/albums
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 25 Oct 2010, 16:07 |
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Joined: 12/18/07 Posts: 20042 Post Likes: +8487 Location: Chicago
Aircraft: Ex PA22, P28R, V35B
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reading material Attachment: Bonanza Reasons.doc Quote: When I set out to purchase an airplane, I considered all models. The result is that I found no airplane that meets the goals of efficiency, maintainability, and versatility as a Bonanza or Baron. I ruled out all other contenders for those reasons. If you do your homework you will likely reach the same conclusion. To enumerate:
1. The Bonanzas were marvelously engineered from their inception. Too much to go into detail here, but I'd recommend getting a copy of Larry Ball's book Those Incomparable Bonanzas if you're interested. The landing gear, for example, is a particular favorite of mine. It's simple and engineered to take a great deal of abuse. Rig it properly once and it will remain trouble-free for decades. Wear components basically come down to the motor, uplock cables, canvas covers, and uplock block springs. They're not inexpensive to maintain, they're downright cheap. Some details, such as the cabin door and aft control surface "mixer" assembly appear mechanically complex but for whatever reason have required nearly zero maintenance for six decades.
2. No other airplane can match a Bonanza's speed range. It flies well fast, and it flies well slowly. The very early models had low gear extension speeds but that was quickly rectified in later years.
3. The skins are Alclad, which explains why a fifty year old Bonanza will be corrosion-free whereas a comparable Cessna will not. Look at the aluminum structural members that hold a 1970's Cardinal wings together for a really scary sight.
4. It's comfortable. The wing carry-through structure was designed so as to seat occupants in a natural seated position. Later models have wide fore and aft seat adjustments, and some have as many as six seats. A Mooney has less overall drag but at the expense of seating occupants with their legs more extended. Which would you rather sit in for a long flight?
5. Maintenance is simple. Don't let anyone else tell you otherwise. Ask a mechanic which he'd rather replace - a Bonanza's fuel bladders or a Cessna's for instance. And whereas Piper or Cessna parts may be cheaper, they're not much cheaper, and you'll buy them more often. Beech parts are engineered to last. Parts are readily available as well as many PMA alternatives.
6. All airplanes have ADs. I'd argue the Bonanza has the fewest and most easily complied-with ADs of any airplane anywhere.
7. Can't speak for models with tip tanks or other auxiliary fuel sources, but the fuel system on my V35 is mind-numbingly simple. The gauges are frighteningly accurate. For some reason a fuel imbalance doesn't become as objectionable in roll as it does in a Piper, for instance.
8. There were over 10,000 Bonanzas built, and that's just the 35 series. If something breaks you'll enjoy more support than any other airplane in existence.
9. Bonanza vs. Mooney. This comes down to mission profile and taste. The old cliche is that the Bonanza is the Cadillac of airplanes, and I agree. If that's true Mooneys may be the Porsche. If you only fly by yourself without a lot of "stuff", you may enjoy the efficiency of a Mooney. If you fly with family or friends and their "stuff", the choice obviously favors Beech. And I don't know why, but it always seems Mooney drivers have a hard time landing them. (note: The Mooney sits closer to the ground, so the ground effect is much stronger until the laminar flow wing suddenly stops flying and dumps you on the ground. Then you bounce on those rubber donuts.)
10. The only comparable airplane that does everything as well as a Bonanza is a Baron. If a Baron is too rich for your taste, consider a Travel Air. A D95A is a Baron with two bulletproof and inexpensive engines. From time to time for whatever reason the light twin market becomes ridiculously cheap. Now is one of those times.
The ugly? Honestly, I can't think of anything to be particularly wary of. Like any old airplane, make sure its paperwork is correct and make sure the airframe is what it should be. I tend to dislike most aftermarket "mods", but that's just my taste as I think it would be difficult to improve upon Beech engineering. Obviously training and proficiency is a must, but that's true of any high performance airplane.
Might as well get a Bonanza, you will eventually anyway.
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_________________ Falsehood flies, and truth comes limping after it. (J. Swift)
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 25 Oct 2010, 16:09 |
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Joined: 06/14/09 Posts: 745 Post Likes: +9 Location: Chicago, IL (KGYY), GA, KVLD, FL, KOPF
Aircraft: Cirrus SR22 Turbo
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Username Protected wrote: Hello, Mike. Welcome to BT. Buy a post '83 A36. It will handle your family until the boys start averaging over 150 pounds. As for slickness being a problem: This is only stated by persons who have never owned a Bonanza. Those with little or no experience flying a Bo should not be advising on which plane is best for you. I've flown all the brands and models with more than four seats and nothing comes close to the Bonanza in overall quality and utility. Good luck. +1 You’ll be fine with the A-36. They are complex and quite slippery so you will need to learn to fly by the numbers a bit more than a basic trainer like a 172 or a p-28 but a few hours with a good instructor and you will be fine. I had a 1984 A-36 when my four kids where young and we quite often would pile all of them on board for trips up and down the east coast.
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 25 Oct 2010, 19:39 |
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Joined: 02/14/09 Posts: 6071 Post Likes: +3313 Company: tomdrew.lawyer Location: Des Moines, IA (KDSM)
Aircraft: 1973 Baron E55
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They only word you can't get a hit on when searching BT is, "No." This question has been posed many times before. There are maybe two or three of us out of 4000+ that throw some caution into the wind on this subject. Fellow BT'ers think we are maybe its true. Let the begin. Please take my comments with the good nature in which they are intended. Welcome.
_________________ C340A/8KCAB/T182T F33C/E55/B58 PA 28/32 Currency 12 M: IPC/BFR, CFII Renewal
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 25 Oct 2010, 20:07 |
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Joined: 06/08/10 Posts: 97 Post Likes: +1 Location: Wichita, KS (KICT)
Aircraft: C172S
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Username Protected wrote: ... I have been told bonanzas are too slick of an airplane for my experience level. I only have 100 hr tt working toward IFR but am willing to get all the training needed to be safe in whatever plane I get. ... Can't speak to anything but the V-tailed Bonanza's and only the E35 model of that. I was about your experience level when I joined a partnership in an E35 Bonanza. I recall after my first flight in the E35, walking away from the airplane, I stopped, turned around, looked back at the airplane and said to the instructor, "You know, that airplane is as easy to fly as a Cessna 150!". He laughed, and didn't disagree with me. One of the easiest airplanes I've ever transitioned into. An absolute joy to fly. It is a complex/high performance aircraft, so fly with an instructor pilot with Bonanza experience, get your endorsements, if you don't already have them, and a good checkout in the model. You'll never regret it.
_________________ Tom Veatch Wichita, KS, USA
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 25 Oct 2010, 22:50 |
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Joined: 06/04/09 Posts: 4531 Post Likes: +510 Company: Usually good Location: Chicago - Milwaukee, IL (KUGN)
Aircraft: 1968 Bonanza V35A
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Mike, With about 150 hours maybe 175 I was ready for faster and bigger. I couldn't rent anything but the 182 and while nice it didn't have the .. whatever it is. The bonanza does. My only regret is not jumping in sooner. Do it, and get a good experienced Bonanza instructor then do a BPPP class. Go slow, take your time and fly on safe low wind high viz days for a while. Take a long trip in easy conditions.. Take momma to a fun get away.. You'll love it. Username Protected wrote: Ive been on bt for a few weeks reading about bonanza a36's and I figure it's about time to introduce myself. I've just started flying again after a 7 yr break of having 3 boys ages 4, 7 and 9. I have been studying all kinds of planes and everyone I talk to has a different idea of what I need. I have started flying again got my ticket current. I have been told bonanzas are too slick of an airplane for my experience level. I only have 100 hr tt working toward IFR but am willing to get all the training needed to be safe in whatever plane I get. I would consider renting but owensboro has no planes to rent. I would like to have a plane that will carry my family of 5 and baggage from owensboro KY to any where east of the rockies. I have considered a36 and cherokee 6 among many others. I like the speed of the a36 and the useful load of the cherokee 6 (my wife likes to pack the kitchen sink). The older a36s seem to have more useful load but I like the post 1984s for there dashboard. Any advice will be helpful.
_________________ _________________
Deeds not Words
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 29 Nov 2010, 23:23 |
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Joined: 12/27/08 Posts: 6066 Post Likes: +1026 Location: St Louis, MO
Aircraft: Out of airplane biz
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Username Protected wrote: Any more thoughts on this?
_________________ User 963
There's no difference between those that refuse to learn and those that can't learn!
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Post subject: Re: New member from KY trying to decide what to buy. Posted: 01 Dec 2010, 00:33 |
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Joined: 09/21/10 Posts: 1720 Post Likes: +190 Location: Greenville, NC (KPGV)
Aircraft: 1984 Bonanza B36TC
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MIke, I think I give you a unique perspective on this issue. I trained on Pipers and went on to buy an Archer. I now have 250 hours under my belt. For the past 6-7 months, I searched high and low for the "right" 6 seater. I found and bought my dream plane less than 2 months ago, a 1980 Bonanza A36. It was the best decision I have made in my flying career so far. During my research and learning phase, many of my non-pilot friends never missed an opportunity to explain to me how the Bonanza was so slick. My friends who actually knew a thing or two about Bonanzas, were always encouraging. Useful load: this was very important issue for me. It seems that the later the model, the lower the useful load for most GA planes, including Bonanzas. My 1980 A36 has a useful load of 1310! That's hard to beat. Model year: when I first set my goals, I wanted a post 1984 model. However, the more I learned about Bonanzas, the more I realized that the year was irrelevant. Plus, the price was right. Flying Bonanzas: it is hard to explain what it feels like to fly a Bonanza. I fly a Piper Archer and the A36 regularly. I can tell you categorically that the Bonanza is significantly easier to fly but keep in mind that you need to fly the numbers. I have flown several different planes in my short flying career and none compare to the way the Bonanza flies. This is like explaining to someone what driving a BMW feels like. You won't know what a Bonanza feels like until you get in one and fly it.
Good luck with your search.
Wade.
_________________ Wade Naziri
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