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 Post subject: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 01:17 
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Joined: 12/21/17
Posts: 7
Post Likes: +3
Company: Delta
Location: Malibu, CA
Aircraft: B737
Hello Beechtalkers! Just joined the community a few days ago. I'm a longtime airline guy looking to get back into general aviation. I have two sons that want to go all the way to the airlines and I'm thinking that buying a single engine recip makes sense vs renting when time building for them is the goal. I have very limited GA experience flying C152/172's while getting my PPL in the 1980's prior to Navy flight school in P-cola. Would like to tap all the experience here on Beechtalk in the hope that I can be guided to the best choice in aircraft as well as get advice dealing with the inevitable issues after the purchase. I'm leaning toward a Beech Sundowner/Musketeer mostly just by gut feeling at his point as I have time in the T-34C Turbo Mentor and King Air with the Navy and have been impressed by the build quality. I simply don't have enough experience to make an informed decision at this point so I plan to tap all the experience here.
Thanks in advance for all the help!
Pete VanRuitenbeek


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 01:23 
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Joined: 06/06/12
Posts: 2290
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Company: FlightRepublic
Location: Bee Cave, TX
Aircraft: DA40, C182
Welcome to BT, Pete! I envy you your T34-C time. I logged a few hours in a B-model back when I was a member of the Pt. Mugu Navy Flying Club.

There's a lot of good knowledge here, and I'm sure you'll get some good advice. Good luck with your airplane search, and welcome back to the GA community!

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Antoni Deighton
contactlink.to/antoni.deighton


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 01:45 
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Joined: 12/21/17
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Company: Delta
Location: Malibu, CA
Aircraft: B737
Thanks Antoni. Wondering whatever happened to the flying club at Mugu? I've read about it but can't seem to find any info so I'm assuming it's disbanded? Would be super convenient since I'm only about 20 minutes away.

The T-34 was a blast! Fully aerobatic and super confidence inspiring. It's been 25+ years but I sure would like some time again.

Pete


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 01:52 
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Joined: 06/06/12
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Company: FlightRepublic
Location: Bee Cave, TX
Aircraft: DA40, C182
The PMNFC was disbanded about fifteen years ago. The cost of the looming wing spar AMOC threatened the club's finances, but the final nail in the coffin was when one of the T-34s suffered a gear up landing. I was only a member for about a year, but I enjoyed my time flying the T-34.

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Antoni Deighton
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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 07:26 
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Joined: 11/08/12
Posts: 12798
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Location: Jackson, MS (KHKS)
Aircraft: 1961 Cessna 172
For a purchase budget under $100k, any plane you’re looking at is going to be older than your sons and maybe even older than you. The condition of an individual airframe is going to swamp any inherent advantage in design.

My quick and dirty rule of thumb - no six months without an oil change since the last overhaul. That’s good for the engine but also implies a plane that has been flown and maintained. You will be ASTOUNDED how few planes this leaves available. Don’t be afraid of, say a 12,000 hour airplane with a 500 hr, 3 year old engine.

If you’re looking at 500+ hours, a lot of costs will end up being minimal assuming you get a decent engine and uncorroded airframe.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 08:08 
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Joined: 09/10/13
Posts: 2278
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Location: Lexington, KY
Aircraft: B95A Z526F SU26
Welcome!

While I know it's not a Beechcraft; there is a very good looking Stinson 108 for sale here on BeechTalk with a great price.
viewtopic.php?f=43&t=146999

Low entry costs would take the worry out of airplane ownership and a 108 would make a fine PPL plane and time builder for your sons while you learn the market and plan the follow-on airplane with the money you saved on the first plane.

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Steven Morgan
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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 08:55 
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Joined: 08/23/11
Posts: 2106
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Company: Delta/ check o'the month club
Location: Meridian , ID (KEUL)
Aircraft: 1968 Bonanza 36
Welcome back Pete.

All I can say is don't be surprised when more has changed than you expect as you get back into GA. I didn't fly GA for about 15 years while on Active Duty (USAF) then jumped back into it just before going to the ANG and Delta. It's a different ballgame in the GA world these days- much more technical with tons of fact mixed with opinion and OWT on the interwebs. It's going to feel like going to recurrent in an airplane you've never flown. :) Glad you found BT - great community here with tons of no-kidding experts and people who love the brand. Good luck in your search!


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 09:33 
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Joined: 03/01/14
Posts: 2128
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Location: 0TX0 Granbury TX
Aircraft: T-210M Aeronca 7AC
Skip the Musketeers and get a Bonanza, you’ll spend similar $$$ and be a lot more capable.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 09:44 
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Joined: 08/26/15
Posts: 9514
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Company: airlines (*CRJ,A320)
Location: Florida panhandle
Aircraft: Travel Air,T-6B,etc*
Username Protected wrote:
My quick and dirty rule of thumb - no six months without an oil change since the last overhaul. That’s good for the engine but also implies a plane that has been flown and maintained. You will be ASTOUNDED how few planes this leaves available. Don’t be afraid of, say a 12,000 hour airplane with a 500 hr, 3 year old engine.

I agree with Charles. For better or for worse, a lot of this segment has airplanes that would have fetched their asking price a few years ago, but they've seen little use over the past few years... which makes them not really worth as much.

The corollary of this is that if you do find an airplane that you like but it was infrequently flown, then set aside a post-purchase budget to address the issues that will inevitably come up. In the sub-$100k market you'll probably find examples of deferred maintenance and the airplanes might be hiding a minor surprise or two (not the good kind). Set aside $20k for that first year of ownership blues and go into it with realistic expectations.

All that is if the engine or engines look good before purchase.*


* lots of good threads on here about that- search for "pre buy" or "pre buy inspection" and read to your heart's content!


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 12:08 
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Joined: 11/08/12
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Location: Jackson, MS (KHKS)
Aircraft: 1961 Cessna 172
Username Protected wrote:
Skip the Musketeers and get a Bonanza, you’ll spend similar $$$ and be a lot more capable.


The mission is timebuilding for two new pilots. 4 seat, fixed gear, fixed pitch with lycoming is hard to beat.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 12:38 
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Joined: 11/09/13
Posts: 1911
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Location: KCMA
Aircraft: Aero Commander 980
I am going through this with two of my kids, sorta of. One of my kids is an enginering student who might pursue flying as a career. He not sure so he is doing both. He has his private with a multi rating.

My other kid does not want to fly profesionally and has gotten hung up on taking the written.

My recommendation would be to break it down into short term goals.

Soloing, written exam, first solo cross country.

Flying sounds good but it’s not for everybody. One or both of your sons might not be suited for it. They could stall out over any one of those goals. You have to let them do it on their own.

I would wait on buying a airplane till you and yours sons know more about how they take to it.

Camarillo flight instruction is a good school at CMA.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 14:21 
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Joined: 12/21/17
Posts: 7
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Company: Delta
Location: Malibu, CA
Aircraft: B737
Wow! Thanks everyone for the warm welcome. Great advice already in just a few hours since my first post since joining BT.

I posted more details on my situation and asked the community for input in another area of the forum under "Beech Singles" under the topic "Sundowner for time building". Again I've gotten a tremendous response and lots of great advice under that thread.

I have a lot to think about.

Again thanks for the warm welcome and all the great info!

Pete


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 Post subject: Re: Looking to get back into GA
PostPosted: 27 Dec 2017, 17:21 
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Joined: 03/01/14
Posts: 2128
Post Likes: +1608
Location: 0TX0 Granbury TX
Aircraft: T-210M Aeronca 7AC
Username Protected wrote:
Skip the Musketeers and get a Bonanza, you’ll spend similar $$$ and be a lot more capable.


The mission is timebuilding for two new pilots. 4 seat, fixed gear, fixed pitch with lycoming is hard to beat.


You might as well go somewhere while you train and get familiar with the airplane you’ll ultimately end up with.

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